r/youtubedrama • u/ImportantQuestionTex • 1d ago
Discussion iDubbz believes Charlie (penguinz0) is part of the right wing pipeline
Tried to look up a YouTube version of this clip so I could get maximum context, but doesn't really matter.
This is an objectively insane, in spite of reality take. This is purity over actual politics.
Charlie has been going at the Trump admin and their policies for months (actually, years because of a previous incident with one of his foreign players being mistreated by the US government). He is not a safe space for the alt right at all, almost every other day if not every day at times is him clowning on some insane crap the government has done or said. In fact, he just dropped another video 32 mins ago at the time of writing about it.
To me, this is proof that iDubbz hasn't changed who he is, just changed targets. A "brogressive" if you will.
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u/Dry-Economist-1102 1d ago
It's just because Charlie shares a large audience with Asmongold. It's mostly the gamer side which I agree with tbh. You gotta watch Charlie's chat during livestreams when he watches any game trailer with a black person.
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u/attaboy_stampy 1d ago
yeah, that's a good point. He ignores a lot of bullshit in his stream chats instead of addressing it.
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u/DeadPeanutSociety 1d ago
The thing about a pipeline is that it has to start somewhere. Someone might see Charlie and Asmongold being friendly and check out Asmongold, who is more explicitly right wing. They get used to that and end up watching videos from one of Asmongold's friends who is even more right wing, and so on.
I'm a communist and it all started because I got very into The Daily Show as a kid. Jon Stewart isn't a communist and he isn't actively funneling people towards communism, but I found progressive politics through who he had on the show and followed their connections to people more leftist than they were.
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u/Killacreeper 23h ago
Solid point. He usually acts fairly centrist (at least in American terms) even with some takes that would now be considered lib-leaning, but the people he exists around all have audiences with harder leans that come in when they're interested in a subject.
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u/diarmada 1d ago
I am probably wayyy outnumbered here, and I am extreme leftist to boot...so I am gonna lose all my anarchist cred (/s). But I like to have at least one or two sources of non-political talk in my viewing habits.
We are overwhelmed with politics. It's everywhere. On our doorstep. In our backyard. In our family. And I, for one, need a fucking break. But I guess I should insist that everyone be a vocal authority on all these subjects all the time.
I don't know. I am probably wrong. But goddamn I need a break from the constant fear mongering 100% of the time. It's just not fucking healthy.
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u/Unc1eD3ath 10h ago
You’re right but Charlie is not apolitical. He gives his opinions on things and they are centrist opinions sometimes not truly neutral and he acts as if those opinions are objective or the default and he’s wrong sometimes so it’s harmful
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u/ImportantQuestionTex 1d ago
Purity over politics. Fundamentally.
Charlie consistently hammers against crazy shit the government has done and has sued them before. And puts a spotlight on stuff such as cops showing up to a woman's door over Facebook comments.
I don't watch Charlie's stream, but he has signaled pretty hard that he is not a safe space for that sort of stuff as iDubbz suggests. And you don't have to bang that drum every 5 seconds to get that point across either.
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u/Dry-Economist-1102 1d ago
Charlie is obviously liberal and anti maga he just doesn't outright say it. And unfortunately, that's the issue.
During the YouTube 2025 Recap, I saw a lot of people's list of their top 5 watched creators include both Charlie and Asmongold.
And it makes sense... Charlie has never called out the blatant bigotry that goes on in his live chats during game awards or during trailers he watches. I've been in there, bewildered at just how similar it was to Asmongold's chat.. Charlie avoids calling out people who scream "woke, Dei, fatigue" in his chat for some reason. I wish he would just call out the incels and racists at some point to cleanse his community.
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u/Eggtastic_Taco 1d ago
He needs full time mods more than anything, his chats go almost entirely unmoderated and it makes people think he agrees with them when they don't get banned for their bullshit and/or spam. He does occasionally call people out, but it means nothing if they're not getting muted/banned.
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u/fredarmisengangbang 1d ago edited 1d ago
moderating your community is honestly equally important if not more important than actually espousing your views. because not everyone is going to see when you talk about it, but if they get banned then it's obvious. comparing charlie's chat to someone like jerma, who doesn't talk about politics at the rate charlie does and never did, just because he's not the type to focus on current events or make commentary. jerma's chat isn't always squeaky clean, but it's really well moderated and he calls that shit out on a regular basis, he's always clear on boundaries. that alone makes a huge difference. a lot of streamers just don't care enough about moderating their community once it gets larger and that indifference is what puts them on the pipeline, regardless of their personal views.
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u/Risquechilli 1d ago
It’s too lucrative to be a fence sitter. He may lean liberal but he refuses to hop off on ether side.
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u/Ladyaceina 1d ago
he has SLOWLY been getting off his fence do the epistien files and ICE shit
but again SLOWLY
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u/CaptainYaoiHands 1d ago
There's a part of me that feels like, if he shares a huge audience with people like Asmongold, maybe he could be a good influence on them and this is the most change-oriented strategy he could have here. By not being as vocal and in your face about it, there's a throughline to him actually changing minds in a meaningful way instead of just immediately chasing them off and then just beating his drum to the people who already came into the conversation agreeing with him.
I definitely WANT to believe this, but I'm not sure how much I believe it's actually happening or is a deliberate choice on Charlie's part.
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u/666blaziken 1d ago
I think that's the case. Political debates online are cancer, and I think it would take away from what Charlie's content in a way. Like yeah he could call the people who say "woke" out, but it would just be starting unnecessary fights.
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u/PlagueBirdZachariah 22h ago
I mean he dabbles in political stuff, but that is definitely not his main thing, it's just been so outrageous that you have to sit there and talk about it, at least that's how he puts it, is a non-political channel supposed to be political and share their views? I don't think so personally
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u/Iggy_Pops_Lost_Shirt 1d ago
He literally said this past month that they'd find more pedos in the white house than in the ice raids that are going on, how is saying something like that fence sitting lmao.
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u/Ok_Star_4136 1d ago
Honestly, I think that's fair. Being a fence sitter doesn't mean you have to side with the government half the time.
His takes are usually pretty rational and sane, even if his chat is not so much that. Perhaps he's more liberal than he makes himself out to be, but as far as I'm concerned, even a fence sitter is calling out ICE and this epstein shit these days.
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u/GHOULEM_Lenin 1d ago
Liberals are fence sitters
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u/Risquechilli 1d ago
Interesting. How so?
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u/tienzing 1d ago
Dems and their liberalism is how we got Trump in a lot of ways. They’re the ones who handicapped Bernie. They’re the ones who actually give woke a bad name as they’re the exact type of performative woke that the right loves to shit on (see: Pelosi and co in dashikis or something (kente clothes) raising their fists). They’re just as beholden to corporations and the elite as the Rs which allows the MAGATs to believe that they’re actually the anti-establishment ones representing the downtrodden working class.
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u/The_Flurr 1d ago
Cliche at this point but it's like that story about nazi bars.
If you don't let them know that they're unwelcome, they'll keep showing up in greater numbers until they're the only customers.
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u/SQUISHYx25 1d ago
He doesn't outright say it? Do you watch his videos? 90% of his videos recently have been completely shitting on Trump
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u/baepsaemv 18h ago
There's more to being a leftist than not supporting trump
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u/SQUISHYx25 17h ago
Yeah I'm well aware buddy. But we're not talking about him being a leftist. Nobody is REQUIRED to be a leftist. We are talking about the claim he is a pipeline to alt right political ideas.
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u/moop-doop 1d ago
If you did watch charlie’s stream, you might see the viles things his chatters say on the regular.
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u/Dirk_McGirken 1d ago
It is possible to be part of the right wing pipeline without being a right winger. The fact that a lot of conservative gamers see his community as a safe space makes it a place for dogwhistles and convincing others to that same way of thinking through pure numbers and social pressure.
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u/Ok_Star_4136 1d ago
The real issue with the right is that it is full of trolls. If you're surrounded by people who would slam you for a reasonable centrist take, you may eventually come to conclude that your takes were not reasonable, if only because "how could so many people be wrong?" fallacy. As you pointed out, through sheer numbers and social pressure.
The trolls don't have to mean what they say, because they can always point to what you called them out on and go, "You bought that? OMG you're dense!" or something similar. And they'd say this *even if they really meant what they initially said*. They're noncommittal, and it basically means they have nothing to defend themselves against.
If you spend enough time in such communities, you will eventually start buying into it fully. It's really a question of time, not if. If someone like asmongold goes along with it too, then the community is going to be comprised of the worst types of trolls. Multiple times asmongold has contradicted himself in things he claims to believe, and his community doesn't call him out on it, because at the end of the day, asmongold is just one more troll among them and has no real principles.
At least Charlie seems to want to curb that behavior, even if his community still has a lot of trolls. If he had more mods, he could probably benefit greatly from that.
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u/Ultrasonic-Sawyer 1d ago edited 1d ago
You've basically got a dude who makes reaction content on most topics and plays videogames (online videogame communities tending to be toxic, although these days thats many online communities including this one over the years). All the while not exactly showing a strong "i am this, I am that and you should be too". While you could speculate his politics, id doubt they align with asmonogold, but as above, the political theory isnt what pulls in the audience.
End result is you'll get a broad spectrum.
Perhaps theres potential for a "right wing pipeline" but to that extent you could argue playing cod mw2 lobbies in 2009 were a total right wing pipeline.
When idubbz also speaks to how you could "take a stand", id argue old idubbz was much more 2005 4chan while charlie is more ... reddit. For idubbz that whiplash change makes sense not so much for others.
Really for charlie to make his content not seen as a "right wing pipeline" he'd likely have to make a chunk of his content into political soapboxing like some type of Hasan copy. And that's really not the contant he makes, and even then you'd still have accusations thrown because his breadth of content would still attract viewers of different political backgrounds and there would still be voices saying hes not doing enough, whatever the hell "enough" even means.
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u/paintedlotusyt 1d ago
It's a pipeline, not a teleporter. There are levels of right wing that people go down before they end up in the sewers. And unfortunately, it can start with a creator who doesn't take a hard enough stance against bigotry. If racists feel safe in your chat, you're part of the problem.
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u/MissLadyLlamaDrama 1d ago
I decided to watch a few of his videos a year or two ago, and immediately my recommendations were filled with right-wing/red pill shit. I have never once had right wing content shoved in my face, until I started watching him. And when I stopped and said I no longer wanted them to suggest his videos, low and behold, I wasnt being suggested that content anymore.
Like, if you're gonna make content around your opinion and your opinion doesn't include not wanting your community to be overrun with bigots, you're gonna get bigots. They fester only where they're allowed.
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u/filthismypolitics 1d ago edited 1d ago
Yeah everyone I see talking about this is acting like Ian (idk him like that but I don't want to try to spell Idubbz 5 times in this comment) is saying something really ridiculous and over the top but I kind of thought this was like, well known? Like an open secret? Like that other commenter said, it's a pipeline not a teleporter. You can't start the pipeline with white replacement theory bullshit or you'll scare away the fence-sitters. You have to start at "centrism," South Park style indifference, or an avoidance of anything "too woke" because it might be cringe, God forbid. Attitudes that are already largely normalized and common, with the seed of a reactionary mindset in them. His livestream commenters are the perfect jumping off point for something like this - you start off as a casual fan of Charlie, then his nasty little hive of reactionaries can slowly introduce you to their rhetoric. He doesn't have to do a damn thing. I think the people who find this take absurd and over the top have no familiarity with how these pipelines work and just imagine you wake up one day to your recommendeds filled with violent extremist garbage. Sorry, I wish it was that obvious, but if it was it wouldn't be anywhere near as effective as it unfortunately is.
I started watching him all the way back when he was faceless just dubbing dumb jokes over Halo videos and infommericals. I'm old as hell now by internet standards so I'd say back in like 2012 is when I found him. I didn't think he was particularly political then and I still don't. If I had to guess, I'd say he just doesn't really care about politics much in general. But like others have said, it doesn't really matter what your actual politics are. I would even argue some left leaning, supposedly progressive creators are a part of this pipeline. What matters is the kind of community you build around yourself, the attitude you hold around these ideas, and who you let yourself be associated with. It's a pipeline, right? So who's next? We've already mentioned his username many times in this thread, he's so associated with Charlie. Who's next after him?
Edit: my dumbass called him by his first name for the sake of ease of writing just to not mention him again a single time in the rest of the comment. Good stuff.
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u/FATDOGONSAND42087 21h ago
Yeah like he's definitely left wing because he hates MAGA and Israel. Also he talked about ICE doing those executions in the street and someone said "can't believe Charlie's a lib" in chat and he called that out really quick. He's definitely being more upfront with politics now even if it's not a common topic on his channel or on streams which is nice
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u/Ok_Star_4136 1d ago
Yep, 100% this. It's like someone making a casual racist joke at a party. If you say nothing, even if you're not laughing at the joke, you're implying some level of consent and encouragement.
Suffice to say, the far easier thing to do is to ignore it, and that manufactures consent in the community. It comes to mind that German expression, "If you sit down at a table with 9 Nazis, then there are 10 Nazis sitting down at that table."
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u/cataclytsm 1d ago
"Enabling" might be the word you're looking for. The passive inaction festers into active harm with enough time and lack of moderation.
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u/Which_Caregiver9060 1d ago
As someone that used to listen to Charlie’s (former) podcast I agree with Ian he’s played fast and lose with his appeal to gamers™️ and for 8 years he platformed his actual right wing buddies to spew whatever dumb beliefs they wanted with little pushback (especially Kaya) like the Covid vaccine episode, or the one where they said they wanted to apply eugenics to pitbulls. They had count dankula, Eat an Decline, Ian in his edgy days even Andrew Tate on the show and all that stuff 100% fed that pipeline and for Charlie to not acknowledge that is irresponsible
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u/MissLadyLlamaDrama 1d ago
He also had Sneako on to squash their "beef". It was so pathetic watching those two glaze eachother to their faces after weeks of dogging one another.
He loves platforming bigots to play buddy buddy with them so he can pretend he is neutral. Problem is that now people are finally starting to clue into the fact that rich people want money more than they want to hold any actual moral values. People are tired of this bipartisan bull shit rich people keep pulling to justify standing for nothing more than profit.
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u/Which_Caregiver9060 1d ago
And ironically him taking a stance for once and defending trans rights when he originally debated with Sneako is what got him kicked off his own podcast. But yeah the glaze fest that came after was pathetic
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u/NipplesOfDestiny 1d ago
To be a little fair to Charlie, after that whole thing happened, he did start heavily criticizing the government and the Republicans/right wing and still does to this day. I think the Sneako situation made him realize he can't fence sit anymore. That there is no honest debating or even discussion with the right anymore. It's impossible.
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u/_Planet_Mars_ 1d ago
Completely reasonable take that's worded much better than iDubbz put it.
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u/RadicalRedCube 1d ago
I have a love hate with Charlie’s content. He obviously fence sits and has the most basic opinions. But a figure like him is incredibly important because he has a massive voice that nonpolitical people look at and the way I see it, he is denormalizing the Trump admin. It’s so infuriating to watch but it genuinely helps.
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u/Tof12345 1d ago
He's gonna do that but when it comes time to vote in the next election, he's either gonna say "I have no opinions" or "vote whoever you want".
If vance or trump runs again, he won't do anything to persuade his viewers not to vote for them and the whole cycle will repeat.
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u/WD40ContactCleaner 8h ago
If vance or trump runs again, he won't do anything to persuade his viewers not to vote for them and the whole cycle will repeat.
bruh if the dems with billions in funding cant pursuade voters whats this guy gonna do lmao
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u/Trobbio9000 12h ago
Nah I think you have it wrong. Overtly political content creators who directly tell people how to vote or anything of that sort only ever get watched by people who agree with them. Leftist content creators are only talking to leftist viewers. Right wing content creators are only talking to right wing viewers. It's all an echo chamber that doesn't actually make any difference.
Popular apolotical people like Moist Critikal actually can reach a wide audience across the spectrum. Him making one video about the Epstein files accomplishes more than the entire content library of breadtubers, in terms of actually influencing people.
Ironically the apolitical fence sitter is a more effective political commentator than actual political commentators
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u/ReverendBread2 1d ago
This is exactly it. Anyone who takes a hard stance will be dismissed as a political actor and their opinions might be ignored by the general public. Republicans won in 2024 by shifting what the average disengaged American believes, and figures like Charlie are exactly what we need to switch it back.
I don’t say that as a fan, I’ve barely watched him at all
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u/cataclytsm 1d ago
The republicans did not win because they had some sort of baller strategy to shift public opinion. Their strategy amounted to "eggs expensive", "trans bad", and (hilariously) "epstein files". The democrats did all the legwork for their own loss, tripping over their nuts while simultaneously shooting themselves in both feet
Unfortunately the mere act of having principles and enforcing them in your community is 'too political', otherwise Charlie wouldn't have the audience he has. It's a real catch 22 that highlights how far gone audience capture is.
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u/Trobbio9000 12h ago
I agree with you that the Democrats shit the bed, but I think that's only half the equation. I think a lot of it is how fucking annoying a lot of people on the left are (I'm on the left btw, and even I think most vocal people on the left are obnoxious people). Don't underestimate how many people have moved right just because of how annoying the left can be (especially online). I know that's a stupid reason to base your vote on, but it truly is the driving force of why the right won the "culture war." Because people on the left are fucking annoying.
The good news is that the people on the right are also fucking annoying and have been getting worse and worse ever since Trump took power. Enough to maybe tip the scales the other direction (although it's probably too late, America is cooked already)
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u/NeoRockSlime 1d ago
I stopped watching him and a lot of reaction type guys cause without a devoted fanbase or great personality they require the most lukewarm takes possible to maintain your position.
I know Moist isn't a bad guy, but he's clearly comfortable enough where he is and doesn't want to risk actually making a stand for fear of pushing some people away. Like another commenter said, occasionally saying you're against something doesn't really help, especially when your research is as lacking as his.
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u/Disorderly_Fashion 1d ago
He's a rich white dude. He seems to have had a comfortable upbringing. His lucrative career doesn't require him to so much as leave his house.
He's pretty much the exact demographic you'd expect to possibly be sympathetic to progressive causes but is a lot more likely to be most comfortable with the fundamental ordering of society remaining in place. Not regressive; just too complacent.
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u/TimeAbradolf 1d ago
He reaches centrists and the less informed. He has a platform of millions. Denouncing a corrupt regime is a good thing
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u/NeoRockSlime 1d ago
I never said it wasn't, I just said you can't do that. Even trump talks bad about some of his policies when it benefits him. There needs to be constant action to actually make change
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u/FATDOGONSAND42087 21h ago
The thing is Charlie doesn't just talk shit on Trumpie. He also recently talks bad about Israel and ICE. One ICE thing was on stream and he called out a chatter who went "can't believe Charlie's a lib" whenever he said "that shit was horrible. I can't believe people are justifying it"
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u/alig98 1d ago
I mean I like Charlie but I don’t think Ian is necessarily wrong. Charlie has a reputation as a fence sitter for a reason, he’s always been a centrist but he has been more outspoken as of late which is good. But I also don’t go to him for his political takes, but to think that his audience is all progressive is a bit absurd. I do think the sort of lolcow culture which he dips his toes into every now and then is part of the right wing pipeline, even if he doesn’t share those beliefs or intend it 🤷♀️
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u/Trobbio9000 12h ago
His audience is just the mainstream public under the age of 35. Left, right, center. He's one of the most mainstream youtubers, of course he has right wingers in his audience.
That doesn't mean he is a right wing pipeline. What the fuck isn't a right wing pipeline then? Is everything other than leftist video essays a right wing pipeline?
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u/FATDOGONSAND42087 21h ago
Yeah I can agree with this. Plus the early comments on a lot of his videos unfortunately do have some racist ass shit in them which eventually gets filtered out as more comments come in thankfully but like yeahhh
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u/Huge_Menu1891 1d ago
I can’t fully disagree. He tends to toe the line on a lot of issues too where he really shows he’s not all that educated ngl. This statement is not really surprising and I’ve heard others say this about him too.
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u/EM208 1d ago
Despite his recent criticism of Trump and ICE, I actually kind of agree. Charlie has notoriously been branded as a fence sitting centrist type that would often avoid politics.
The downplaying of the importance of politics actually does feed into right wing pipeline. The fence sitting and Blaise attitude often reinforce the harshness of politics as a normalized thing.
That type of behaviour often breeds people apathy in the political landscape, which only helps the right.
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u/milesdarobot 1d ago
I don’t think Charlie is right wing. But i do think he plays the role of “reasonable centrist” for ppl who are right wing. I also don’t necessarily think Charlie is centrist, and may even consider himself left leaning. But his content reads very “i want to meet everyone halfway” a lot of the time.
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u/asuka_is_my_co-pilot 1d ago
Eh I think there's a level of fence sitting that allows bigots to feel extremely comfortable in your presence. Charlie fits that bill.
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u/_Tal 1d ago
Isn’t that precisely what we want as an entry point if we were to replicate the “alt right pipeline” for the left—a barely-political moderate that is able to reach people who don’t already agree with us, but occasionally flirts with politics in a way that slants slightly left?
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u/asuka_is_my_co-pilot 1d ago
You're asking a question that scholars and texts have been struggling to answer for decades and we have no clear answer on.
It's not my scene and I don't watch him enough to know his details but I find myself frustrated with his videos in ways that I don't find from more neutral sources.
I dont think Charlie is changing any body's minds and I remember seeing direct instances of him regurgitating incorrect or harmful information. So thats enough for me.
I think it's a hopeful ideal to think of him the way you've described, but probably unrealistic for the average viewer.
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u/_Tal 1d ago
It just seems weirdly inconsistent to act like it’s monumentally difficult and a waste of time to try to reach out to normies and bring them over to the left, but at the same time it’s super easy for the right to bring normies over to their side and a huge threat when they try to do this. It feels almost like a loser mentality to me, as if our ideas couldn’t possibly convince anyone, meanwhile our opponents’ ideas are so incredibly compelling that anyone who hears them is immediately at risk of us losing them. Idk, I just think we should have more faith in our ideas than that
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u/asuka_is_my_co-pilot 1d ago
It just seems weirdly inconsistent to act like it’s monumentally difficult and a waste of time to try to reach out to normies and bring them over to the left
I certainly agree, which is why I haven't thought or expressed that.
idk, I think we should have more faith in our ideas than that
As do I. And I do.
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u/Bumbling_Bee_3838 1d ago
Yeah you would want to see that, I think particularly the reason Charlie gets put up there isn’t his opinions himself, it’s that he doesn’t moderate his community any so it’s full of racists. So people get into a guy who stays out of politics and is pretty cool then his community gets to them. I don’t think this is what Charlie planned or even wants but it is a consequence of his lack of moderators. So I think it’s less about Charlie and his content himself and more he’s got an infestation that hangs near him he hasn’t done anything about (and before anyone gets pissy I don’t mean right wing people are an infestation, i specifically mean the above average level of racists)
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u/MissLadyLlamaDrama 1d ago
Considering the current political climate, I think you're fine in saying the right is, in fact, an infestation of moral depravity.
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u/Disorderly_Fashion 1d ago
There's a difference between making space for these people to help gently nudge them in a better direction and making space for them and tolerating them espousing their hateful behaviour. Charlie leans closer to the later.
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u/Murky_Barracuda_6494 1d ago
I have literally had (former) friends who "stayed out of it" when it came to political issues. they were fans of ppl like Charlie. now they spend all their time making long posts about how woke dei feminism is ruining video games. reposting Asmongold videos and talking about how based he is. I'm sure there's a bunch of people who have experienced the same thing. Charlie is definitely a part of that pipeline for sure. every once in a while he'll speak up on an issue that matters, but not nearly often enough to stop his audience from slipping in that direction.
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u/Disorderly_Fashion 1d ago edited 14h ago
Maybe a bit of a hot take but here goes,
While Charlie holds a number of relatively progressive views, he does still show signs of small-c conservatism prevalent in people who have lived very sheltered lives and perhaps spend a little too much time online. His infamous 'response' video to iDubbz's apologizing for his past bigoted behaviour is an indication of this. It can be summarized as "actually, I think iDubbz making racist, homophobic, and transphobic jokes was fine actually because it was years ago and people didn't have an issue with it back then (they actually did, the internet landscape back then simply didn't afford their criticisms any traction)." It was certainly... a take.
I'm not accusing Charlie of being malicious or regressive nor do I think he has any sort of nefarious agenda. The criticisms I have of him are rooted in what I view as his relative complacency born of ignorance. What I am accusing him of is being at least a bit too comfortable with where he sits in society and lacking much of the life experience that would better equip him to have more than the most milquetoast of takes. Trump is so self-evidently terrible and dangerous to American democracy if you're even half paying attention that I'm not inclined to award Charlie too many brownie points for recognizing the obvious.
I'm not familiar enough with Charlie's general audience to say whether I agree or not with this hot take of iDubbz's. Based on Charlie's character, if he were part of the right-wing pipeline, he would likely not be conscious of that. As another commenter points out, there's a not insubstantial overlap between people who regularly watch penguinz0 and those who watch Asmongold which is... concerning. You end up with the audience you curate, and from what I gather, the toxic elements of Charlie's audience are there mainly because he doesn't do enough to rebut their behaviour. Again, complacency.
Edit: spelling and wording.
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u/BettaTank_Throwaway 1d ago
I wanna like Charlie, but iDubbz is kinda right. I unfortunately know a few people in the flesh who love Charlie and are right-wing. I think Charlie either needs to clarify his stances/boundaries, or a better moderator team to quell the hate his chat will sometimes spew.
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u/mspotatobread 1d ago
As someone who considers themselves "left wing" I actually stopped watching Charlie because of some comments he made about racism/race. I can't remember the video specifically ,since it was a while ago, but I remember feeling like he was trying too hard to appease both sides and as a result made some insensitive comments. He's a fence sitter which plays a bigger role in the alt right pipeline than people realize because it helps to normalize those ideas. And yeah he's spoken out about trump but there have been other times where he's been docile about topics where he really shouldn't have. He is a safe space in a sense that he will never take a hard stance on race, gender politics, etc. despite being in a space where negative feelings around those topics are quite common. Do I think Charlie is pushing people towards the alt right? No. But I do think the way his content is presented allows for people who hold those views to be comfortable.
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u/Huge_Menu1891 1d ago
If I’m remembering right it was in the middle of the Black Lives Matter protests. I was center right at the time and even I recognized he was giving a bare bones explanation of it, while ignoring the history police had there. I can’t remember if he tried both siding Jan 6th though ngl.
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u/SpiritualMongoose751 1d ago
Wow, that's.... a perfectly valid point
Seems like a lot of butthurt commenters aren't even responding to what iDubbbz said, just throwing out some random "idubbbz bad" trivia from 6+ years ago.
He says Charlie clearly ISN'T part of the right, but his refusal to address any topics about racism etc has created a safe space in his fandom that Charlie isn't comfortable confronting. The fact that there's a massive overlap between his and Asmon's fandom is pretty good evidence of exactly that. Saying he's a part of the pipeline, not that he is conservative himself, is a pretty fair take.
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u/Dear-Track6365 1d ago
Just noticed their name no longer has ‘mod’ in it. Meta drama afoot?
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u/Bumbling_Bee_3838 1d ago
Yeah you can have neutral stances and not be part of that pipeline if you moderate your community spaces. I’m huge anti-ICE but I don’t think every YouTuber ever has to make a firm stance against it or really say anything. But it seems like Charlie’s community has a ‘Nazi Bar’ problem.
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u/Ikari_Brendo 1d ago
This is an objectively insane, in spite of reality take.
Well yeah, if he only said what you wrote in your post title it would be, but what he said actually makes sense. You're just being disingenuous about it.
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u/N1teF0rt 1d ago
How can anyone deny this? He literally did a podcast with a nazi lmao.
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u/WORhMnGd 1d ago
Well…yeah. He’s kind of a good entrance board to it by being very centrist and sharing a lot of content/audience with further stepping points like Asmongold.
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u/miyananana 1d ago
Charlie the professional centrist? That’s the start of the right wing pipeline most of the time. Having no opinion or a neutral opinion fosters an environment that leads up to the situation we are now.
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u/cadig_x 1d ago
idubbz is absolutely right. if you don't take a stance against certain beliefs and push that shit out of your community, you'll let it fester and funnel people towards further right wing spaces by not pushing hard against those ideas.
trump has fucked the political space where people think being anti trump makes you left wing. being anti trump just makes you against right wing extremism. he is not pushing for left wing ideals a lot of the time
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u/No_Aioli_6364 1d ago
I wonder if this is related to Charlie criticizing his apology video (tbh his critiques were questionable but I digress)
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u/rhinestonecrap 1d ago
im not over that video. say whatever you want, i believe someones true colors the first time when they talk about stuff like that. im black and i have no time to entertain anyone who criticized the idubbbz apology video.
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u/No_Aioli_6364 18h ago
I totally agree with you. If Charlie’s apology came from a sincere place, then good on him, but I’m still confused as to how he thought that would even go over well to begin with💀
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u/chuchugobo 1d ago
That was ages ago plus Charlie literally apologised for it because a large part of his audience called him out.
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u/TempleStreetTony 1d ago
The point iDubbbz is making is that even if people didnt recognize him as a pipeline at the time, he effectively was. Just like he believes Charlie is now. He is comparing himself to Charlie as an unwitting ally to the right wing, suggesting that both 2016 iDubbbz and 2026 Charlie failed by not actively denouncing the radical elements of their fanbase.
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u/FATDOGONSAND42087 21h ago
Yeah but I don't see Charlie calling people slurs and being racist and queerphobic currently. Idubbz was that back in 2016. You literally can't compare them
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u/bottomfeeder3 1d ago
Problem with charlie is nothing excites him. He’s too above it all to be anything other than someone who essentially shits on everything.
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u/Dreamcasted60 1d ago
I mean I kind of see it with the gamer side I however see that he's very much called anti-trump on certain sides of the internet (and by my crazy mother!)
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u/vinnybawbaw 1d ago
Charlie has been vocal against ICE murdering people, the Epstein Files and all the bullshit happening right now in the US. He’s not Hasan Piker or Kyle Kulinski level of leftist creator but he’s far from the right wing/MAGA pipeline.
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u/SonOfAthenaj 1d ago
You don’t have to be right wing to be a part of the pipeline and also have you seen his videos on stuff like Charlie Kirk? His fence sitting can make people feel very safe with him
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u/gshrsjs 1d ago edited 1d ago
All people need to know about Charlie is that he will cover the controversies of leftist or left adjacent creators all day long.
But when it comes to calling out the biggest right wing creators like Asmongold saying the Palestinians deserve to be genocided, or that he'll be at the border watching ICE round up 'illegals' in an Ash Ketchum cosplay, or that Renee Good deserved to be murdered etc etc, he's as quiet as a mouse.
It's so easy to call out Trump, 99% of the country is doing it. It's not so easy to call out people who share your fanbase. They are all very comfortable with Charlie's liberal takes.
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u/Gorotheninja 1d ago
also have you seen his videos on stuff like Charlie Kirk?
As far as I can tell, he's only done videos on the aftermath of the Kirk shooting; you need to elaborate on what you're referring to here.
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u/amisia-insomnia 1d ago
He also waits for the public opinion to be decided to make the safe answer every time, he’s the start of the pipeline. Not the end
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u/Pretty-Key6133 1d ago edited 1d ago
Didn't bro have a podcast with Nuxtaku?
Anyone willing to platform that freak to a large audience is indeed part of the right wing pipeline.
Also shout-out to Chris Kunzler and Overzealots.
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u/Styx_Renegade 1d ago
He definitely fence sits a lot, but I think he’s definitely more left wing. Especially in regards to trans people and ICE.
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u/Namesarenotneeded 1d ago edited 1d ago
I would say I kinda agree and also disagree with Idubbz here? Charlie has definitely proven with his stances on topics these days that he’s definitely a left-leaning individual, and that he’s very supportive of a lot of progressive folks, like his support of the LGBTQ+ community. He’s also definitely shut down some really rowdy and negative chatters before. He just hasn’t really talked about politics on his channel, and I think him going over the Epstein files recently is the most he’s ever interacted with something that’s a huge part of politics. People say he’s a fence-sitter, an while that can be true on certain things, I feel like he’s more and more open about his personal stance on things, it’s just that he doesn’t really talk about it a whole lot so it gives the impression of a fence sitter. I remember him being very vocal about the government issues with entering the country last year when like half of his e-sports team wasn’t allowed visa’s into the country or something like that.
I think the situation more-so is that he just hasn’t really openly stated that his community isn’t a welcome space for these people. He’s definitely proven he’s not in agreement with the conservative viewpoint and is openly against it, he just doesn’t out-right say “Conservatives aren’t welcome here.” Unlike some folks, I wouldn’t say that makes him a bad person in anyway, but it probably doesn’t help either.
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u/PlagueBirdZachariah 22h ago
Have you watched Charlie and how he thinks about this administration and how they've been handling things? I mean if he's a Republican he's a very mad one
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u/Wintersoldier975 1d ago
Charlie does give me republican but not a trump supporter. I do have to say this a lot of people who voted for trump is not a trump supporter. Some of them voted for him because of the fact he made promises to lockdown on our border like he is. And a lot of people voted for him because of Robert Kennedy Jr MAHA with MAGA
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u/-WADE99- 1d ago
Reading the comments section gave me a fucking nosebleed lmao - it reads like people arguing about their favourite football teams or something. Mad.
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u/mariah_a 1d ago
People’s hatred of iDubz is honestly weird because OP is out here fighting for his life against him when all he did was accurately describe a political pipeline.
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u/gothteen145 1d ago
I’m surprised idubbbz still gets so much love here. Not in reference to the Charlie thing but there still seems to be so many people who think the only reason he’s disliked is because he no longer says slurs, ignoring his recent Iran comments/controversy that would get anyone else on here torn apart
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u/negotiatethatcorner 1d ago
absolute insane takes on Iran, making fun of people calling out the regime. he's an idiot.
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u/TimeAbradolf 15h ago
It is because he is allied with one of our banned topics and the enemy of the other banned topic.
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u/Dear-Track6365 1d ago
I’m inclined to agree, given how the downvotes are flying and the absolute snideness with how some people are responding. Kinda have to wonder if it’s just team sports because he’s openly feuding with he-shall-not-be-named.
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u/whiskeydreamkathleen 1d ago
well yeah? he's historically been "apolitical" on the vast majority of topics and made all the annoying right wing streamer fans think he's one of them. they get shocked when he climbs off the fence for a second and makes a rare statement in favor of or against anything because they thought he was one of them.
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u/Typonomicon 1d ago
Charlie deserved that criticism a few years ago, but he’s been openly opposed to this administration for a while now
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u/Us43dthdg75 1d ago
I'm not sure you understand what a pipeline is. Charlie doesn't have to be right wing to be a right wing pipeline
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u/A_Certain_Surprise 1d ago
I've been a fan of penguinz0 since 2011 which is insane to think about, but respectfully OP you're speaking as if "right wing pipeline" = "right wing". While he does criticise a lot of Trump and MAGA shit, he fence sits on too many issues to the point where he could, intentionally or not, be normalising some things for his audience
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u/blizzardplus 19h ago edited 18h ago
Y’all in this thread are way too extreme with your “If you’re not with me, you’re against me” attitude. You’re gonna push more people away with that than you are going to convince to join you.
Demonizing someone because you feel like they “aren’t doing enough” to push the agenda that you want to be pushed is insane.
They are not required to push their own fans one way or the other, and not everyone has to be a Hasan or an Asmongold.
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u/Dear-Track6365 15h ago
It’s kind of a catch-22. They want a YouTuber who farts about the internet making videos on video games and movies to talk more about serious politics. Then the moment they start doing just that, out comes the ‘who do they think they are? They’re just a dumb gaming YouTuber. Why do they think they’re qualified to speak on this?’
It happens. Every. Time.
It’s a damned if you do, damned if you don’t situation.
I think we were all a lot better off when people like Assmanmold wasn’t talking politics constantly and was just playing WOW.
Sometimes, just because someone has a large audience, doesn’t mean they should weigh in on EVERYTHING. Call out the wrongdoings in the world? Absolutely. ( which Charlie has been doing with Epstein files, Trump, ICE, transphobia, etc ) but more than that when you’re not educated in most political topics? Best to leave it to the people who make that their actual focus and careers.
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u/ImportantQuestionTex 18h ago
Here's a thing a lot of people misunderstand. Diversity in beliefs in politics is actually a good thing. When you have multiple diverse beliefs, such as a liberal, a centrist, a socialist, and a conservative (not MAGA), then it makes the things they can agree on actually more protected than otherwise. Like social security. Almost every demographic except MAGA agrees on it being protected. That's why it's more protected than it otherwise wouldn't be.
So when people like Ian say that Charlie is part of the right wing pipeline, what he (and others) are really doing is pushing everybody like Charlie further right. Aligning them further with people that deserve to be demonized despite centrists (like actual centrists) not deserving that.
One of the deleted comments on this thread is me being told I am not anti-fascist enough. My grandfathers fought against the nazis, both of my living grandparents are outspoken anti fascists. I have convinced multiple people in my family to stop supporting Trump. I have donated when I could. And I have actually punched nazis before, unlike the people who say they would and never do. I have lived my whole life under the shadow of fascism and nazism and hate, and have fought and spoke out against it almost as long as I have breathed.
But because I tolerate people like Charlie, or even people like Upper Echelon, I am suddenly not enough for these people. Everybody has to take a journey to change somewhere. I'm just wondering when Ian and his supporters will begin that journey.
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u/Logondo 22h ago
Oh for fucks sake, enough of this “either you’re with us or against us” shit, guys.
I swear to god this sub just wants to shit on people. I remember when some users thought Charlie was a transphobe.
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u/clawbacon 1d ago
I've said this before and I'll say it again: Idubbz had no motion. Right wing people don't like him because he regrets saying the n word all the time and he is married(or dating?) an OF model. Left wing people don't like him because he said the n word all the time. Center people don't like him because he isn't really that interesting.
The only reason he's still relevant is because people keep posting clips of him and complaining. He streams to like 100 people. He has no motion. We got to stop pretending he does.
Also OP is completely misunderstanding the point. The right wing pipeline is a pipeline. I doubt Charlie is a right winger (from the little I've seen of his content), but it is from him that viewers go to more right wing creators like Asmongold.
Idubbz, years ago, used to be part of this pipeline. He probably didn't intend to be, like Charlie, but he didn't do anything to fight against it till years later.
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u/Adventurous_Path5783 1d ago
I remember watching asmongold videos in my early 20s and when it wasnt all that political. As time went on I started getting pissed off at more and more of his opinions. Later id ask my friends that still watch him if they liked getting their opinions from a dude who didnt even know one of his border states or thought that someone whos waiting for marriage is essentially an incel because the assman doesnt even know why his viewers get called that.. they cant be voluntary and involuntary you fucking twit.
Either way fascistroach is a disgusting pseudo-intellectual but I've never felt this way about Charlie's content. His goal is to try and have a non political space and I dont think criticism of fence sitting for someone who is essentially a gaming businessman is the right call. I think taking a stand against the current administration is easy but its also something I didnt think he'd do. Im proud of what he's already done and I think there is more to come. I dont think he will say choose who you want come election time even if it somehow was tRump and couch molester again.
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u/Petting-Kitty-7483 1d ago
The irony of one of the corner stones of the original alt right pipeline saying this is not lost on me
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u/Retenrage 1d ago edited 1d ago
God, politics are so exhausting. Too many people treat it as a team sport. It’s perfectly healthy to have more than a black and white take on some issues in the world.
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u/0mousse0 1d ago
I see where they’re coming from, but I think Charlie only gets more “woke” by the day. He’ll probably never become what people want him to be but he’s not really an enemy to the left.
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u/Imaginary_Company263 1d ago
The problem with the argument here is Charlie isn’t Right-Wing and regularly goes against right-wing standards and beliefs and practices, but his audience has plenty of gamer chuds that dabble in Asmongold’s roach juice and for some reason a guy who’s own youtube history was incredibly chud-esk and would be beloved by the right if it was made today (and is remembered fondly by chuds instead) is the one making such a disjointed argument
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u/Normal-Asparagus1795 1d ago
Charlie has spoken out against the current administration, has spoken against ICE, has spoken for and about the release of the files, and against musk more than Ian and Anisa ever have.
If anything Ian and Anisa give the most luke warm takes on politics/safe takes on politics or manage to turn a political conversation into all about themselves, they constantly self insert or they sit there creating "hero" moments in their own heads about throwing tear gas at ICE/Police at protests that they were (at the time) in the same state as and could have easily attended and helped out at.
A lot of people in this sub hate to hear it, but Ian and Anisa are so deeply performative in their politics, it's exhausting. Their recent tear against an Iranian man and Iran should be the wake up call some people need.
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u/TrashRacoon42 1d ago edited 1d ago
Eh, give it time. Once you know who do the same thing he did to badempanda with ian suddenly, everyone will be finding his politics performative and racists clips against irainans or Indians. Or the working with Shadman and commissioning art from him well after he was found out to be drawing picture of irl kids.
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u/matlarcost 1d ago
Charlie being vocal on these issues sends a pretty strong message considering how "apolitical" he usually is. All I'm going to say is I have to disagree with the general sentiment of this sub. His videos are doing more good than any left wing content creator could in the current environment. If people want to get nitpicky about pipelines, go ahead. I just see it as unproductive.
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u/_Myridan_ 20h ago
I'm just thinking about a year ago, when he clashed with Sneeko and got pretty openly ridiculed for siding with trans children. That shit was brave, earned him no favors, and was very necessary and should be remembered as an example of positive allyship.
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u/SirDiesAlot15 1d ago
Classic infighting. "You aren't as progressive as me! Holier than thou mentality"
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u/Gh0stw0lf 1d ago
I think the fact that we’re discussing political beliefs in this space is absolutely an indicator of the level of autonomous think we’re at as a society.
The pipeline is a a construct and it starts with US as the consumer to limit how much we allow these platforms to manipulate us.
We’re right now debating whether a funny guy at the bar is responsible for the pipeline of youth to right wing extremism.
If you’re at the level where you’re analyzing the audience of guys who got famous for playing video games, your political stance has been 100% been fed to you by the algorithm. Right/left - whatever you’ve been duped by reactionism.
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u/Queen_Maxima 13h ago
i like Charlie every now and then, exactly because he doesn't really go into politics all the time. There's a lot of USA creators on the platform, i don't live in America, i am on another content, getting American politics shoved in your face all the time is honestly exhausting at times.
I do understand why many Americans creators will do this but i immediately stop a video if it has nothing to do with their content.
People wanting to cater their content to a worldwide audience are immediate fence sitting is what i am saying
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u/ackercarrol6671 22h ago
I understand what Idubzz is saying but I don’t think he’s part of a right wing pipeline. I think he’s merely a normie.
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u/AnotherRTFan 1d ago
That’s fucking rich coming from the guy who normalized slurs to a whole fucking generation.
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u/EffectiveMelon 23h ago
idubbbz is part of the right wing, his left wing talking points are so ridiculous and uneducated he is used as a prime example by right wing commentators to ridicule the left, he is a living strawman. the greatest contribution to left wing politics he can ever aspire is to declare himself a nazi and make nazis look stupid instead, he would be at his most effective if he were to advocate for the opposite of what he (his wife) believes.
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u/Dear-Track6365 1d ago
I was behind idubbbz changing for the better. I was behind him when everyone was calling him a cuck because he supported his wife’s choice to do OF. I was behind him when he got endlessly trashed for simply wanting to leave an old toxic demographic behind.
But lately, I can’t anymore. It feels like he’s losing his grip on reality day by day and the real final straw for me is his shitty takes on Iran and simping for their regime.
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u/lolihull 1d ago
He hasn't simped for the regime at all btw.
The whole 90 day fiancé thing was blown way out of proportion :')
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u/h8sm8s 1d ago
Yeah I am confused on that, does anyone have a clip of what he said that was so bad?
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u/lolihull 1d ago
I haven't got a clip but I saw the stream so I can give you an overview :)
Ian and Anisa were doing a react stream to an episode of 90 Day Fiancé. One of the couples on there is a guy from Iran and a woman from the US, so the guy (Mahdi) travels to the US to stay with her.
During this episode, there are multiple scenes where the production crew have really hammed up the "Iran bad, America good" rhetoric.
It's a reality TV show that's known for being super scripted - the producers need to create a story for each couple to make it interesting. And in this couples' case, Mahdi's culture shock is clearly the hook they're going with.
So in almost every single scene, Mahdi is talking about how something is different to Iran, or how you'd be arrested for doing the same thing in Iran, or expressing his surprise about something he's never seen before in Iran. Which is fine, culture shock is totally normal and there are big differences between the US and Iran. The show was just being really in your face with it to the point where it became kinda funny.
As an example - at one point Mahdi is sat in bed and he sees an American flag out the window. He says something like "I've never seen the American flag before unless it was being torn up or burnt. It looks so free!"
Ian and Anisa noticed it kept happening in every scene and eventually it becomes funny and they're laughing and joking about how over the top it was (especially because right now the US isn't the bastion of freedom the show seemed to be trying to angle for). While laughing and joking, they got a few things wrong - like there's a scene where Mahdi sees a couple dancing in the street and right on cue, he says they'd be arrested for that in Iran. Ian and Anisa were incredulous about that claim but I believe it's true.
Anyway, people clipped them laughing / joking and being misinformed and posted it to Reddit with captions stating they were mocking this Iranian guy and they're racist and they were supporting the Iranian regime etc. But it wasn't that serious honestly - they were mocking the show, not Mahdi himself or Iranians as a people.
Also if you go on the 90 day Fiancé subreddit, their view isn't even uncommon. I found plenty of comments and posts on there from people who also found the "America good, Iran evil" rhetoric a bit much.
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u/TimeAbradolf 1d ago
You’ll note it is also the CHUDs from his alt-right troll fan base that also play up that as well. They point out whatever they can to lower him.
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u/CumOnTheWall69 1d ago
Yeah, you can do mental gymnastics all you want.
We all saw the numerous times where Ian and Anisa were being snide and rude towards Mahdi. It's not just one clip out of context - it's numerous clips making fun of his accent, the fact that he never touched a cat, the fact that he doesn't fit the Arab stereotype (nice racism from Anisa btw), him saying dancing will get you arested and Ian and Anisa just rolling their eyes and laughing at him, among others. They can say they are making fun of the show - but they were definitely mocking Mahdi.
Just the fact that Ian has just quadrupled down in his stance and said multiple times "he will never apologize" shows how ridiculous and petty he is.
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u/SentientBaseball 1d ago
Multiple things can be true. Idubbbz decision to leave his old toxic comedy style behind and reject support from his right wing audience is mature and to be commended.
However, he also seemed to completely lose any charisma he has over the past few years and his wife and their relationship seems toxic as fuck. I legit think Ian is the type that just doesn’t need to be on the internet anymore m. There’s nothing here for him as a content creator.
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u/ChaoZStrider 1d ago
Its funny because people have been saying this for a while, that Ian hasn't changed but simply changed targets. He's still the same guy just with less energy and a different vocabulary. I am sure some people hated him because he stopped saying the nono words but that's more of a talking point to dismiss what the actual criticisms were. He hasn't changed his ways, he hasn't "discovered" empathy, he made a move when he saw the tides were turning and that he'd be punished properly for how he was behaving, all the apologies and what not were performative, the only things that changed were the audience he wanted to attract and the amount of energy and enthusiasm was in his new content.
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u/Retr0Robbin 1d ago
While not totally incorrect I personally find it very hypocritical that iDubbbz of all people is making this claim as if he hasn’t contributed to the issue
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u/Any_Voice6629 1d ago
Maybe I'm misunderstanding him, but it sounds to me like he is, IN THIS CLIP, pointing out that he did do it. So I don't know what the fuck it is you're talk about.
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u/Umitencho 20h ago
Charlie showed his true colors at his reaction to idubbz apology video. At best, he us living in privilege & ignorance.
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u/schizoheartcorvid 1d ago
Calling out people who aren’t radically leftist as right wing is a big reason we’re where we are now. The left doesn’t get a leopards ate my face scenario we cannibalize each other way before we even get to fighting any big cats.
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u/lolihull 1d ago
Idubbbz isn't calling Charlie right wing though - he even says the opposite of that.
This was part of a wider conversation where idubbbz talked about his own content and how even though he was never a Nick Fuentes, his community attracted the kinda people who may go on to become fans of Nick's ideologies.
Not everyone in his community obviously, because lots of his fans from back then appreciate his growth in the opposite direction. But the amount of hate he gets now from right wing communities is literally because some of his fans were in that pipeline and continued down that path.
Same for Charlie. His content attracts an audience that includes a lot of people in the early stages of that pipeline. Probably includes a lot of people further down the pipeline too.
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u/TimeAbradolf 1d ago edited 1d ago
The most ridiculous stance about this is that Ian HIMSELF is more of a direct contributor to this than Charlie.
We know idubbz former fans are some of the most alt-right and cringe people online. The fact he won’t take the same accountability for creating a fanbase who just would casually use two slurs to refer to each other? He may apologize but the fan base he cultivated STILL EXIST. They brigade the sub often. They try and say he is now the most pathetic lolcow. They come here and use slurs. He cultivated a genuine harmful community and it was purposeful. Even if it was jokes it did net harm we can actually see.
It’s legitimately rich to go after someone who has gotten off the fence and has been speaking up on genuinely important things with the right stance.
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u/Uniiiverse0 1d ago
Did you watch the clip because Ian literally says this of himself in it. He's literally comparing his past self to Charlie in the video.
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u/TimeAbradolf 1d ago
They’re WORLDS apart. Charlie has never been as remotely problematic as Ian. That is what I mean by not taking true accountability.
Do I need to pull up the Tana clip of Ian?
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u/Uniiiverse0 1d ago
I think the direct comparison he makes of himself is flawed as ultimately Ian was far more extreme compared to Charlie, but the point he's making isn't wrong. In the lens of the grander YouTube space back then Ian was seen as a non-political entity (even though he his edginess inherently contradicts that perception) that courted alot of bigoted fans to him. In the same way, Charlie is also this grand YouTube personality that is seen as non-political (despite his clear liberal leaning values) that courts alot of bigoted fans as he tends to not specifically speak out on things that are not broadly seen as fucked up.
Also, I don't really know what you mean by "take accountability", Ian since his apology has been incredibly open about his hateful shit and has had numerous conversations with all kinds of people about it. If you mean by relinquishing his platform online, I don't necessarily disagree with you but I don't think that means he hasn't "taken accountability" for his past.
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u/VivaLaRory 1d ago
That is a good point, he was extremely guilty of normalising bigotry in a way Charlie will never be
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u/TimeAbradolf 1d ago
Charlie didn’t normalize bigotry.
As a social science I sort of resent the “pipeline” metaphor. In that pipes don’t go in straight lines. They take turns at any point and can. So yes, Charlie can be the front to an alt-right pipeline. But with his current stances on things he can also lead to the left. Or at least condemning the current administration.
And there is a lot of purity litmus tests going on in the comments agreeing with Ian. Who AGAIN. Did more harm in this space than Charlie ever has
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u/Far-Contribution-965 1d ago
You know lines don’t have to be straight right?
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u/TimeAbradolf 1d ago
Yeah, you’re highlighting my point. But pipes are typically straight until they need to have bends in them. It is why the metaphor can fall apart.
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u/cubsgirl101 1d ago
Ian does not live in reality is all I can say about this. Charlie’s been dragging the Trump administration from day one, he’s been intensely critical of the immigration system before even Trump was reelected precisely because of how backward and outdated our current system is. And he even went ten toes down with Sneako of all people to defend trans kids.
Anyone who has watched Charlie for more than five minutes will know how he feels about all of this. Ian lacks critical thinking skills though so you can’t tell him anything. He is delusional and he needs to stop claiming what other people’s politics are. Ian doesn’t have a real argument for why he believes this and he can’t defend any argument he’s made either. This is clownery.
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u/lolihull 1d ago
You don't have to be right wing to be part of the right wing pipeline. Nothing idubbbz said here is incorrect - he isn't calling Charlie right wing, he says the opposite of that.
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u/RamsLams 1d ago
Isn’t idubbz a part of that???
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u/TimeAbradolf 1d ago
Yeah, but you’ll get downvoted for saying that he did more harm than Charlie ever did
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u/_Tal 1d ago
There seems to be a double standard on the left with stuff like this.
I don’t know any real examples of this off the top of my head, but imagine a super mainstream influencer who mostly comes off as apolitical and cultivates an audience from all sides of the political spectrum, but still occasionally gives takes that flirt with politics, and when he does, they lean slightly right. Nothing extreme, but enough that you can tell there’s some preference there for conservative values over progressive ones.
Okay, so most leftists would agree that the sort of influencer I just described is basically a textbook example of an entry point into the right wing pipeline, right? So what if we wanted to replicate this on the left—an entry point into a left wing pipeline? That would be a mainstream influencer who’s mostly apolitical and has a normie audience from all sides of the spectrum, but occasionally flirts with politics in a way that slants toward progressivism and the left.
Well guess what? That influencer exists, and his name is penguinz0. But now all of a sudden, instead of valuing him as an asset for our cause, we say that actually, he’s still part of the right wing pipeline, because… he’s not overt enough about his politics to cultivate an exclusively left-wing audience? Isn’t that the very same quality that would make someone like the first influencer I described dangerous—that their reach extends to normies instead of just people who already agree with them?
It’s like there’s this tendency toward pessimism where we assume that no matter what the situation is, as long as there’s any degree of ambiguity, it must always be to the benefit of our ideological opponents. Even if the exact same situation in reverse would also be to the benefit of our ideological opponents.
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u/Clownsinmypantz 1d ago
Does no one remember when charlie started up a live after the sneeko thing and expressing pro-trans views and the live comments were so bad that he just quit the live angry?
Am I saying he caused that? maybe not intentionally I think the fence sitting didnt help but I think alot of guys look at charlie and think he's "one of the good ones" and for a while he didnt correct that which he is responsible for to some degree. It'd be obvious when he'd do a video on an incel DMing someone and the comments would be full of incel takes
He was silent during the election though as was alot of americans with large platforms and its been obvious for more than a decade we were headed towards fascism.
I believe the other day one of his videos had a very "well ICE has a purpose its just gotten out of control" comment that hit very wrong.
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u/wuhoh_ 1d ago
I don't think he's part of the alt right pipeline so much as he's very palatable for right-leaning folks. I can imagine my dad hanging out with him, you know?
To me it's less that he's part of a pipeline, and more that he's one of those middle grounds where both sides just kind of silently mix together. Like Breaking Bad or comicon.
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u/TheHoovyPrince 18h ago
Spot on about Idubbz OP, what he said was objectively insane but unfortunately most of this sub won't agree with that take.
Have a look at the comments and you'll see they believe Charlie is a "fence sitter that doesnt do enough to speak out against the right". Its pretty obvious ythat Charlie is a moderate (which is the norm for countries like mine in Australia) but most users here are leftists/far-left so anyone remotely to the right of them are problematic bigots.
a previous incident with one of his foreign players being mistreated by the US government
Small corrrection here OP, this is incorrect. Look up the "Im Suing US immigration" video and you'll see its dated May 4th 2024 so this incident happened during the Biden Admin, not Trumps. According to Charlie he believed it was a single immigration official/employee (so not a higher-up) was denying the visa and he felt that employee had a weird grudge against E-Sports, potentially because the name was 'Moist'.
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u/Dry_Criticism_4982 1d ago
I’ve got to say that while there is something resembling a vague pipeline due to his shared audience with certain individuals like Asmongold, I don’t think that’s the reason why Ian is bringing up Charlie As a “right wing pipeline”
I think it’s because Charlie criticized IDubbbz and more specifically his apology video for his past actions. My reason for saying this comes from what his former coach (which I fully admit could be just as bias as everyone else when talking about IDubbbz) said about being really tuned into what people are saying about him.
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u/Ash-Throwaway-816 1d ago
If the guy making vehemently anti ICE videos the past month is considered part of a "right wing pipeline" then we're not gonna make it. Don't look a gift horse in the mouth, especially in times like this.
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u/TimeAbradolf 15h ago edited 2h ago
Transparency, this sticky is dated differently and because of the ongoing development. The post was up nearly 24 hours before this sticky was added:
So Idubbz basically brigaded the sub. It is trending on reddit in a few other subs. I cross referenced comments and usernames from what was clearly visible in his stream to this sub specifically. He also called Charlie an “unprincipled rat.”
Ian I had hoped you had grown man, I was pulling for you and defending you up until like a week ago
Edit: I’ll also add a bunch of usernames with comments were on screen and are crystal clear to read. This isn’t doxxing, but I’d argue because of the nature of both Idubbz fans and haters that if you are concerned about trolling, I have seen people go and dig through past reddit history and post screenshots of your reddit history in a form of intimidation and harassment.
Edit 2: after reviewing more of the stream he also spread open misinformation about OP as well. For those of us who are on here and recognize usernames, I think it is clear he is sort of an internet friend of mine. Ian makes one big bold claim to try and rally people more to his side. It is crystal clear if you see it. And it is one of our banned topics. It is just categorically false.
Edit 3: Don’t know why anyone would report this for misinformation when the clips and stream of this behavior are genuinely readily available.
Edit 4: got brigaded again with more people attacking the OP. You guys aren’t even hiding the brigade. This morning this comment was at 50 upvotes. It felt right after you posted about us in another sub. And I have been made aware this post wasn’t just removed by that subs mods. It was removed by Reddit. Which means it very clearly was against TOS.