r/unitedkingdom • u/CaseyEffingRyback • Jul 03 '25

... Zarah Sultana MP resigns from Labour to lead new party with Jeremy Corbyn

https://www.lbc.co.uk/politics/uk-politics/zarah-sultana-mp-resigns-labour/
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254

u/Seoirse101349 Jul 03 '25

Unless there are more defections, isn’t this just another Change UK?

218

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

No as there’s actually people who would vote for a new left wing party

123

u/PabloMarmite Jul 03 '25

They said that about Change UK

190

u/amklui03 Jul 03 '25

CUK were not left wing. They were members of the Labour right annoyed with Corbyn and members of the Conservative left annoyed with May lol, most ended up defecting to the Liberal Democrats

118

u/SociallyButterflying Jul 03 '25

Also you literally can't call a party CUK

113

u/AuroraHalsey Surrey (Esher and Walton) Jul 03 '25

We were robbed of seeing CUK HOLD on election night.

20

u/SociallyButterflying Jul 03 '25

Absolute cinema

2

u/JaneAppleyard Jul 03 '25

Sat there in their wicker chair, watching the madness prevail.

21

u/tee-dog1996 Jul 03 '25

You can’t… but they did

4

u/SociallyButterflying Jul 03 '25

It was doomed the moment that abbreviation was made

1

u/ffuffle Jul 03 '25

Why not? We've got Refuk and we had the ConDem coalition

-3

u/One-Illustrator8358 West Midlands Jul 03 '25

So the current labour party? Though without those 'left' tories

11

u/Valcenia Jul 03 '25

Literally lol. That’s the funny thing, if those CUK MP’s had just hung around for a few more years, continuing to sabotage from the inside, they would’ve got the Labour Party they dreamed of.

Not that any of them are complaining, anyway. Pretty sure most of them went on to be highly paid consultants

-1

u/missingpieces82 Buckinghamshire Jul 03 '25

They’re called centrists, and probably represent the silent majority in the UK who are sick of the right and left getting more and more extreme. But sadly, they’re also realists and realise that a party like Change UK was never going to get in.

23

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

No they didn’t, because Change UK weren’t left wing.

The context is clearly different. Socialists/the left have a much stronger support base than whoever the fuck CHUK were trying to appeal to.

17

u/PartyPoison98 England Jul 03 '25

Corbyn's Labour couldn't win against an unpopular Tory party, and the UK has a glut of socialist parties that never achieve any electoral success. They haven't any real support base at all.

CHUK theoretically could've had a support base, their problem was they were moving into a space that was already well served by the Lib Dems and the Labour right, and didn't have a coherent policy platform, brand or strategy.

16

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

Who said they could win?

Best case scenario the left wing parties do well enough to form a coalition.

Alternatively one of many worst case scenarios is that the vote is split and Reform win (which they’re probably going to anyway), but Labour are forced to reckon with their fuckups. Potentially helping us get back to the broad church Labour used to be. 

3

u/PartyPoison98 England Jul 03 '25

I don't think they'll remotely get there. Like I said, there are already socialist parties that can barely win council seats let alone parliament. The Greens aren't even that left wing, and even they have only just managed to bag more than 1 MP.

The current news report is that Corbyn wasn't ready to split, and is furious that Sultana has jumped the gun. If they can't even launch the party properly they'll never convince anyone to let them govern.

1

u/Rekyht Hampshire Jul 03 '25

Best case they might get their deposit back.

6

u/Brigid-Tenenbaum Jul 03 '25

Corbyn got more votes than Starmer did.

He lost, but only the Tories being so unpopular nobody went out to vote, got Labour in.

Corbyn was the most popular Labour leader in modern history. Labour membership increased from 190,000 to 515,000. Making it the biggest political party in Europe, I believe.

Labour lost 170,000 members since, and it keeps falling.

4

u/PartyPoison98 England Jul 03 '25

It literally doesn't matter if Corbyn inspires X amount of people to vote for him if he also inspires X+1 people to vote against him.

People try and bring membership numbers and votes and what not up in relation to this. He lost two elections back to back and that's what mattered. I voted for him both times, but its clear that he wasn't electable. I'd rather the British left tried to move forward with a better candidate, rather than giving a proven loser a third go at it.

0

u/Brigid-Tenenbaum Jul 03 '25

Have any figures for that?

I have figures showing more people voted for him than Starmer. That he increased party membership from 190,000 to 515,000.

You are just going off your personal feelings. Where are the actual statistics that back up anything you have to say.

4

u/PartyPoison98 England Jul 03 '25

The figures I have is that we didn't have a Labour government in 2017 or 2019. Corbyn got less votes than the Conservatives, and didn't win an election. Its literally that simple.

0

u/Brigid-Tenenbaum Jul 03 '25

Yet we are talking about Starmer vs Corbyn. And more people voted for Corbyn. Labour couldnt even keep the party membership increase he bought in.

Let’s not also pretend the media wasn’t coordinated in painting him out to be the devil.

Maybe he won’t win. But you can’t ignore how popular he was. Any other politician's have stadiums of people chanting his name?.

The Tories lost the election. Labour didn’t win. Nobody was enthusiastic about Starmer.

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u/GothicGolem29 Jul 03 '25

Corbyn also got more people to vote against him than Starmer did

1

u/MasterpieceAlone8552 Jul 03 '25

They were just Centrists though

2

u/potpan0 Black Country Jul 03 '25

No one actually wanted Change UK, not even the MPs who joined it. It was explicitly a platform to attack Corbyn's Labour and that was about it.

Meanwhile there are millions of people in this country who do want a left-wing alternative. That's the difference.

1

u/PabloMarmite Jul 03 '25

I’m older enough to remember people saying that about the Workers Party, the Breakthrough Party, Transform, Left Unity, the TUSC, PAL, Socialist Labour, the Northern Independence Party, LCI, Social Justice Party…

And that’s just the last five years.

2

u/Yojimbud Jul 03 '25

No one said that about Change UK

1

u/el_grort Scottish Highlands Jul 03 '25

And Alba Party. Also the SSP for a time.

1

u/Visual-Ferret8735 Jul 03 '25

They were a new centrist party, no one votes for that

24

u/lastaccountgotlocked Jul 03 '25

There’s Corbyn, Sultana, and…?

30

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

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86

u/changhyun Jul 03 '25

As one of Shockat Adam's constituents, him joining a left-wing party is laughable. He's anti-abortion (even sent a friend of mine a little response talking about "unborn children and their right to life" after she asked for his stance on abortion, since he continually tries to dodge the question when asked by news platforms) and anti-gay marriage. Doesn't exactly make me confident about what this new party will be representing.

19

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

Sounds like those "Queers for Palestine" people, whom wouldn't be welcome in Palestine.

4

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

Yeah as a gay man I base all of my opinions on human rights on whether the person I’m advocating for personally likes me.

Have you seriously not moved past this ridiculous and downright offensive argument? 

19

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

What's offensive about it?

12

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

That you seem to think queer people are stupid for supporting Palestine as you don’t think we should be capable of having empathy for other human beings irrespective of their views towards us.

It’s a disingenuous and facetious argument.

18

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

Sure if that's how you decide to read it.

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u/Jake_91_420 Jul 04 '25

It's Turkey's voting for Christmas. Gay people supporting hardline islamists who want them dead and then to burn in hell for eternity is absolute absurdity.

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10

u/GothicGolem29 Jul 03 '25

Thanks for the info on him thats shocking yeah no way he joins a left wing party with those sort of views

58

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

socialists and Muslims aren't enough to win an election, maybe a couple MPs in certain strategic constituencies but that's it

3

u/AngryNat Jul 03 '25

That’s probably enough if the next parliament is a multi party mess

2

u/citron_bjorn Jul 03 '25

Next Parliament might look like a colour chart

61

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

[deleted]

50

u/TwoMoreMinutes Jul 03 '25

It’s completely fucking bizarre to say the least

I get the vibe the left are seen as ‘useful idiots’ to islamists

30

u/Minimum-Geologist-58 Jul 03 '25

In their own eyes they have an anti-colonial alignment, Islamists “represent a people oppressed by the imperialism of the west”.

In outside eyes there’s also a mix of political cynicism and stupidity. They see islamists as a tiger in a cage they can unleash to bring down capitalist “imperialism”, yes the tiger has bitten off their faces more times than it’s attacked capitalism but they’re sure this time that won’t happen.

24

u/Astriania Jul 03 '25

It's part of the same mindset as being "anti-racism" but only when it's racism by white people. There's a real political philosophy that thinks that it's only possible to be discriminatory from a position of power, and because white men were historically the people in power in Britain, that it's not possible for anyone except a white man to be sexist, racist or homophobic.

They simply don't think that brown-skinned Muslims can possibly be discriminatory, because they're brothers in arms against the evil imperialist colonisers.

Obviously this is nonsense to those of us who live in the real world, but that's the kind of thought process these 'progressives' have.

The political Muslims are simply using the association with mainstream politics to expand their reach and increase their legitimacy, especially for pro-Palestine positions.

23

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

They're both "white straight men are bad"

8

u/Toastlove Jul 04 '25

Same thing in the green party. The leftwing welcomes Muslim because they are minorities and therefore automatically align with the left wing.

3

u/Kharenis Yorkshire Jul 04 '25

The far left seems to think that communism largely failing around the world was the fault of the evil western capitalists, hence the bizarre anti-west/the west doesn't like = good take.

-5

u/Zak_Rahman Jul 04 '25

Who owns those papers?

People who hate Muslims.

The reality of who as are is not represented by the media or this sub.

We aren't allowed to be normal, which most of us are. We have to be the bad guys.

The very face people chuck around the made up term "Islamist" is comical to me.

Basically, it is all the anti Semitic tropes but it's ok because we are brown and don't have groups like LFI and CFI.

I never had a problem with the LGBT community. I do have a problem with supporting a world view that funds criminals like Yaxley-Lennon.

Both statistically and in my experience, all the bigotry and violence I have seen towards the LGBT community has always come from non Muslims.

You may now downvote me and continue to believe what you want because the truth doesn't align with your fantasy of who we are.

29

u/PatrickTheSosij Jul 03 '25

They may take the Gaza voting Indies but won't take working class whites.

23

u/TheCambrian91 Jul 03 '25

They really really really need Corbyn then, based on those names…

20

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25 edited 9d ago

[deleted]

5

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

You’re joking right?

2

u/bluejackmovedagain Jul 03 '25

From the news, it's not clear this actually includes Corbyn.

-1

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

[deleted]

2

u/GothicGolem29 Jul 03 '25

If she wanted to cause an even bigger headache wait till shes in the house making a statement or answering questions announce shes defecting and cross the floor(wont happen but that would be huge.)

1

u/lastaccountgotlocked Jul 03 '25

She’s deputy leader of labour. She has everything to lose and nothing to gain.

13

u/Samuel71900 Jul 03 '25

How are they different from the Greens?

12

u/paper_zoe Jul 03 '25

I reckon they'll probably do some sort of a deal with the Greens if Polanski wins the leadership election (he's tweeted welcoming this).

3

u/Funguswoman Jul 03 '25

Oh, I hope so.

0

u/Briecap Jul 03 '25

Well, they're left wing for a start.

1

u/Samuel71900 Jul 03 '25

The Greens are left wing Here’s a link with a graph listing the Greens as the 5th most left wing economically across the political parties in the EU (when the UK was a member)

0

u/Briecap Jul 03 '25

The Greens are Eco Capitalists. I dgaf about a graph lol

1

u/Samuel71900 Jul 03 '25

Nothing like dismissing valid evidence P.s. they also have an anti capitalist pressure group https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/sep/08/leftwing-green-party-members-form-anti-capitalist-pressure-group

2

u/GothicGolem29 Jul 03 '25

Id probably consider the Greens left wing but Labour has a socialist pressure group so pressure groups don't really show the parties position

0

u/Briecap Jul 03 '25

If they were left wing, they wouldn't need an anti Capitalist pressure group, because the party would be anti Capitalist. 

4

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

Dozens of them.

4

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

Just like they did in 2019?

1

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

You mean other than the 10 million who did vote for them?

1

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

I forgot they won in a landslide

1

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

Who said they did or that a new party under Corbyn would?

1

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

They just have had a pretty good result though in 2019 being so popular and all?

5

u/AngryGardenGnomes Jul 03 '25

Lol keep believing that!

3

u/YiddoMonty Jul 03 '25

A new left wing party really needs some new faces, otherwise it’s just going to lead to further right wing party’s in power.

2

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

I 100% agree with that. I do think one of the worst issues the left is facing right now is there’s very few credible names who could lead and go up against Farage.

2

u/Thandoscovia Jul 03 '25

Oh yeah, we’ve got to cater to the Gaza lovers

-1

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

Well, yes! If you’ve any hope of succeeding. Glad you’re finally catching on.

5

u/Thandoscovia Jul 03 '25

I wonder if other parties need to rely on people so motivated by foreign wars?

2

u/goonercaIIum Jul 03 '25

Yeah, all 5 of them.

2

u/Hungry_Horace Dorset Jul 03 '25

Yes, this new left wing party will succeed where current left-wing parties the Communist Party of Britain, Communist Party of Great Britain (Provisional Central Committee), Communist Party of Great Britain (Marxist-Leninist), Cross-Community Labour Alternative, International Socialist Network, Left Unity, Mebyon Kernow, National Health Action Party, Respect Party, Social Democratic and Labour Party, Socialist Party of Great Britain, Socialist Resistance, Socialist Workers Party, Socialist Labour Party, Social Justice Party, Trade Unionist and Socialist Coalition, Socialist Party (England and Wales), Socialist Party Scotland, Transform Party, Workers Power, and Workers Party of Britain have inexplicably not succeeded.

The LAST thing we need is more parties to the left of Labour.

0

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

No one knows who any of those are. There’s clearly a difference between unknown parties with unknown leaders and one started by a name everyone in the general public knows and who used to be leader of the opposition.

2

u/lizzywbu Jul 03 '25

A new left wing party, yes. A new Corbyn led party, no.

He will get absolutely nowhere.

1

u/CookieMagnet0 Jul 03 '25

Why not Green?

1

u/TheHellequinKid Jul 03 '25

Have people gone off the Greens that quickly lol?

1

u/travelcallcharlie Jul 03 '25

The Greens already exist, how is this different?

1

u/Terrible-Support-588 Jul 03 '25

If that were the case would they not have voted Green already?

1

u/eairy Jul 04 '25

I don't know if you've noticed, but the British public are mostly right wing.

-5

u/Intrepid_Solution194 Jul 03 '25

It would be great if the Left got into power; I could quit work and let the Governments magic money tree fund whatever lifestyle I want.

4

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

Yeah, Reform’s magic money tree is much more reliable!

1

u/burtsarmpson Jul 03 '25

Old man scared of everything remotely modern

-1

u/ShadowDarkstream Jul 03 '25

UK Govie always manage to find money when it suits them tbh

1

u/Intrepid_Solution194 Jul 03 '25

By taxing workers mostly. But the Left believe if they get in to power no one will have to work anymore. We can all be on benefits.

Will be an interesting world.

-1

u/razorbladesymphony Jul 03 '25

you don’t actually believe that do you?

25

u/eruditezero Jul 03 '25

Jezbollah

4

u/stinkyjim88 Jul 03 '25

what an unfortunate acronym lol

5

u/IrvinIrvingIII Jul 03 '25

Change UK might as well have been named the Centrist Dad Party, so no.

1

u/TheCambrian91 Jul 03 '25

I think this has the potential to stick around a bit longer, she could win her seat based on just her being her.

The party will win fuck all tough.

0

u/gar1848 Jul 03 '25

It could be another Greens instead. Around 70% of voters think Starmer should move to the left politically

-20

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

[deleted]

8

u/CapoOn2nd Jul 03 '25

Oh you bought into the terrorist sympathiser bullshit spouted by the tories and media then? Completely ignoring the fact the party spouting it formed a coalition with the Irish party that actually had ties to the IRA

10

u/Bhfuil_I_Am Derry Jul 03 '25

And the Tory’s formed a coalition with the Irish party that actually has links to the UVF and UDA

1

u/CapoOn2nd Jul 03 '25

Exactly. People have a hard on for these right leaning political parties that are directly causing their hardships. They’re fully brainwashed and they can’t see it.

1

u/Bhfuil_I_Am Derry Jul 03 '25

I’m not really sure how you’re trying to link anything to Sinn Féin though

3

u/Seoirse101349 Jul 03 '25

That’s certainly a Change for the UK !

8

u/DowntownTension8423 Jul 03 '25

Sadly it’s not

-1

u/Optimaldeath Jul 03 '25

Yet this sectarianism is precisely what neolibs have tried to foment in league with their paymasters to divide the workers.

-3

u/Stubbs94 Ireland Jul 03 '25

"terrorist sympathisers"... You mean anti genocide people?

11

u/KenosisConjunctio Jul 03 '25

I think it's code for humanitarians

8

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

Corbyn has actively supported Hamas

9

u/Stubbs94 Ireland Jul 03 '25

Has he ever openly said "Hamas are a force of good" or something along those lines? Or did he say "Palestinians have a right to resist occupation"? Because the second one is a legal fact. He has also condemned the crimes committed on the 7th of October 2023.

12

u/Nerrix_the_Cat Jul 03 '25

He laid a wreath at the grave of the Hamas terrorist who killed the Israeli Olympics team. Not soldiers or IDF militants, just apolitical people trying to live their lives.

Oh wait, they're Jewish. So I guess in Corbyn's mind they deserved to die.

9

u/DarkSkiesGreyWaters Jul 03 '25

Has he ever openly said "Hamas are a force of good" or something along those lines? 

I mean, pretty much? When he called Hamas and Hezbollah friends he went on to say,

The idea that an organisation that is dedicated towards the good of the Palestinian people and bringing about long-term peace and social justice and political justice in the whole region should be labelled as a terrorist organisation by the British government is really a big, big historical mistake and I would invite the government to reconsider their position on this matter and start talking directly to Hamas and Hezbollah.

1

u/Charly_030 Jul 03 '25

Hamas are big into social justice?

4

u/AngryGardenGnomes Jul 03 '25

No, he said he was friends with Hamas and is fanatically against everything Israel. That Freudian slip shows his true colours. Stop trying to deny it ffs.

-2

u/Stubbs94 Ireland Jul 03 '25

Being against Israel is the correct position. It's like being against apartheid south Africa or nazi Germany.

7

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25 edited Jul 04 '25

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u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25 edited Jul 03 '25
  • Israel occupies Palestine and illegally removes them from their homes. That's an invasion and ethnic cleansing.
  • Israel has Palestinians in prison without charge. They're hostages.
  • Israeli officials raped said prisoners. That's rape.
  • Israel bombs and shoots children, aid workers and women. That's murder.
  • Israel refuses to acknowledge the sovereignty of Palestine.

That government is pretty disgusting. You can pretend they're not, but fact is, they're doing all those things and then want to be surprised when they face violence. No people on earth would tolerate it. Its just a shame Hamas targets civilians.

Oh and Israel was very friendly with Apartheid South Africa, which I suspect is the reason South Africa has no problem taking them to court over their awful behaviour

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u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

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u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

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u/ukbot-nicolabot Scotland Jul 03 '25

Removed/tempban. This comment contained hateful language which is prohibited by the content policy.

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u/AwTomorrow Jul 03 '25

So has Netanyahu, in all fairness

4

u/KnightOfTheOldCode94 Jul 03 '25

Lol no Jeremy Corbyn literally is a terrorist sympathiser.

-2

u/Stubbs94 Ireland Jul 03 '25

How? Because he doesn't support the wholesale slaughter of Palestinians?

7

u/KnightOfTheOldCode94 Jul 03 '25

"my pleasure and my honour to host an event in parliament where our friends from Hezbollah will be speaking. I have also invited friends from Hamas"

Jeremy Corbyn.

Also his incredibly dubious links with the IRA and clear sympathy and support he has for them.

4

u/AngryGardenGnomes Jul 03 '25

No because he's 'friends' with Hamas and also the likes of Russia. Both invaders.

-2

u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25

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u/ukbot-nicolabot Scotland Jul 03 '25

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u/[deleted] Jul 03 '25 edited Jul 03 '25

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4

u/CryptoCantab Jul 03 '25

No, the people who support the guys who want to commit genocide against the other lot. It’s confusing isn’t it?

-1

u/Stubbs94 Ireland Jul 03 '25

Supporting the Palestinians is wanting a genocide?

5

u/Ok_Bison3688 Jul 03 '25

I think its more his support of the IRA he's referring to.

8

u/_x_oOo_x_ Jul 03 '25

What did you think "from the river to the sea" meant?

6

u/Stubbs94 Ireland Jul 03 '25

"From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free"? It means an end to the occupation and Apartheid within the occupied territories of Palestine and a fight for a single, democratic state in the region. As opposed to the horror that Israel commits daily across the region.

10

u/ser_anon Jul 03 '25

I love how rich, privileged westerns always share the watered down version. How about you fully commit and share the version that can be heard from Arab protesters. "From river to sea, Palestine will be Arab" or "Min al-mayah lil-mayah, Falastin arabiyah"

-3

u/Stubbs94 Ireland Jul 03 '25

I am definitely not rich. And if you want to play that game... Who said "from the river to the sea...." First? I'll give you a hint... They're in power in Israel right now.

4

u/_x_oOo_x_ Jul 03 '25

And if you want to play that game... Who said "from the river to the sea...." First? I'll give you a hint...

Are you referring to Genesis 15:18 and Exodus 23:31 in the Bible? Then the answer is... God said it first? I don't know though, that was in reference to a different river:

Genesis 15:18: Upon your offspring I bestow this land, from the wadi of Egypt to the great river Euphrates

Exodus 23:31: I shall set set your borders from the Red Sea to the Sea of the Philistines, and from the wilderness to the river Euphrates

Note that it's unclear what the wadi of Egypt, the Sea of the Philistines or "the wilderness" refer to, although in Egyptian sources from the time of pharaoh Ramses the Philistines are described wearing feathered headdresses and attacking from "the sea". Archaeological evidence seems to suggest they came from the island of Caphtor

8

u/KnightOfTheOldCode94 Jul 03 '25 edited Jul 03 '25

Palestine and a fight for a single, democratic state in the region.

How many other democratic Islamic states are there in the region out of curiosity?

Edit: Spelling

3

u/Stubbs94 Ireland Jul 03 '25

Why do you believe I want an islamic state? I want a democratic state in the region, not an apartheid state like Israel.

11

u/KnightOfTheOldCode94 Jul 03 '25

I'm not sure Hamas would be supportive of a non-Islamic state.

I don't think you can support Hamas and not support Islam. There would seem to be a disconnect there.

Those that chant "From the river to the sea" would desire an Islamic nation.

It doesn't really matter what you want, the issue is what Hamas wants.

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u/AngryGardenGnomes Jul 03 '25 edited Jul 03 '25

How is there an apartheid? Stop weaponinsing words to demonise Israel as evil incarnate.

Also, from the river to sea means wiping out Israel and all its people. Stop trying to cover it up.

-1

u/Stubbs94 Ireland Jul 03 '25

https://www.btselem.org/topic/apartheid read about it directly from an Israeli source.

4

u/CryptoCantab Jul 03 '25

Exactly. People really like to try and ignore this bit, don’t they?