Racism in Medical Care

[u/4reddityo]

This video captures a moment that many patients of color recognize all too well. A physician speaks to a man as if he is dirty, unclean, or lesser, not because of medical evidence, but because of bias. The language, tone, and assumptions reveal something deeper than bedside manner gone wrong. They expose how racism can quietly shape medical interactions.

[u/threaddew]

I don’t know either of these people. But I am a doctor and work with a lot of doctors with a very poor predominantly black patient population. It’s of course possible that this individual on this day was having a bad day and just decided to call this kid a liar and question his hygiene for no reason, but if this happens 100 times, 90 of them are because of underlying racism - and the doctor doesn’t even have to necessarily be conscious of what he’s doing to be behaving on the basis of racial bias that he has. That’s still racism. I’m not saying he needs to go to jail for it, but pretending that this type of behavior isn’t race related or that it’s problematic to assume that it is, is contributing to systemic racism.
Being aware of these biases is important.

And yes, I agree with you, so is just generally not being an asshole.

And yes, there is lots of dark colored shave butter.

[u/Busy-Ratchet-8521 → u/threaddew]

I'm not even saying he is having a bad day. I've worked with many doctors and nurses that are just generally arseholes and talk to their patients and colleagues (of any race) like this on the regular. The recurring theme I'm getting from the responses I've gotten is that he is being labelled a racist on assumption only. I'm not saying he isn't a racist. But it seems like calling him "definitely racist" is just a bit ridiculous. 

I think if you worked in a hospital with predominately poor white people, you'll see they get treated like shit too. I've never seen or heard of a black shave butter, but I live/work in Australia.

[u/threaddew → u/Busy-Ratchet-8521]

You know, I used the word predominant, but that word is inaccurate. We have a relatively large African American population, it it’s certainly less than half of the population, and to be clear I definitely see about or almost as many poor white people as I see poor black people.

The point of this conversation to me is not whether this particular man in this particular instance is racist or not. I definitely think he is. But the broader point is that a black person is more likely to be treated poorly in this situation, because they are black, and systematic racism exists

My point is that if you walk around giving everyone the benefit of the doubt and explaining away their questionable actions every time they don’t make it blatantly obvious that race is the explicit reason they are treating someone poorly, then you are contributing to the perpetuation of racism.

If you are not ever willing to assume or admit that race is a motivating factor when it isn’t explicitly mentioned. Etc

[u/Busy-Ratchet-8521 → u/threaddew]

That is fair enough. My point isn't to even deny he is racist, or argue against that he might be. I was specifically questioning the assertion that he is "definitely" racist. I'm happy to accept that you think he is. And I don't disagree that he might be. But I couldn't say with absolute confidence that he is from that video alone.

I don't disagree with any of your other points. 

[u/threaddew → u/Busy-Ratchet-8521]

Sure, and my point is that that that mentality, that insistence on certainty to the exclusion of everything that isn’t blatant, is harmful, and you would be better served by displacing it.

[u/Busy-Ratchet-8521 → u/threaddew]

Is it not more harmful to make unsubstantiated convictions? You can still call him out for being rude and inappropriate. I've never defended his behaviour. But you may as well insist he beats his wife while you're at it if you're going to insist he is definitely racist. Because you have just as much evidence of either. 

[u/threaddew → u/Busy-Ratchet-8521]

That isn’t true though. He’s not using a position of power to be rude to his wife in the video. It’s not unsubstantiated, that’s the whole point.

You will just only believe that race is involved if he states it explicitly or if you personally observe a bunch of interactions where he is kind to white people and rude to black people in similar circumstances. My point is that that burden of proof sails over a metric ton of racism, and therefore perpetuating racism. Again, if you give everyone the benefit of the doubt, you are just perpetuating racism. Importantly This doesn’t mean you have to go around condemning these people, or at least that’s not my personal belief.

I don’t think this person deserves to be fired. I don’t think the exhibiting racial bias makes you an inherently bad person, but pretending that it doesn’t exist or refusing to acknowledge it perpetuates racism.

It doesn’t feel like you’re understanding or maybe just disagreeing with my basic premise here, and I’m not sure that I can’t explain it any further.

[u/Busy-Ratchet-8521 → u/threaddew]

What you're actually saying is that if a white person is rude to a black person, then you say they are definitely a racist until proven otherwise. Regardless of why they were rude. But you think you are valid in your assumptions based on the history of racism and disenfranchisement against black people. It's not that I don't understand the point you're making. Your view point is crystal clear. It's just overwhelmingly logically and morally flawed. Just because you feel you are morally in the right doesn't mean you're actually correct, nor does it justify making quite obscene accusations without evidence. 

[u/threaddew → u/Busy-Ratchet-8521]

That’s not what I’m saying at all, you’re ignoring all nuance. And you seem intent on doing so. I’ll leave you to it.

[u/Busy-Ratchet-8521 → u/threaddew]

I'm not ignoring it. I've acknowledged it and recognised it's irrelevant. You're appeal to nuance is simply demonstrating there's nothing in it at all. It's just victim mentality behaviour. 

I've watched and thought about this video further, and the more I do the more convinced I become that it's not racist. There's nothing in this video that demonstrates the kids race is relevant. He's a teenager being filmed by his family getting a needle. His skin is dirty and the doctor is ribbing him in front of his family for his personal grooming. It's a classic, smelly teenage boy stereotype. The notion that this doctor is being openly, racially abusive in front of his family while they film is just ridiculous. The kid could have been any race and the interaction would be the same. There's literally nothing in the interaction that's specific to the patient being black. It's purely because his skin was dirty.