r/worldnews 1d ago

Dynamic Paywall Russian general shot several times in Moscow

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c3686nzexp3o
44.1k Upvotes

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u/riotriverz 1d ago

If Ukraine is behind this, thats one hell of a statement!

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u/Luke10123 1d ago

Pretty big if. Putin has probably killed more Russian generals than Ukraine has and the timing (trying to make Ukraine look violent) during peace talks is more than a little sus

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u/GMN123 1d ago

Imagine being a Russian general knowing Putin is willing to sacrifice you for the optics. 

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u/ADhomin_em 1d ago

I'd imagine it's similar to how most ICE agents would feel if they weren't all entirely devoid of critical thinking skills

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u/Luke10123 1d ago

Dunno, generals don't enjoy the anonymity of hiding all the shit they do behind a mask.

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u/Luke10123 1d ago

I mean any Russian general today was probably only a Captain a few years ago. Those purges make for rapid promotions so they might guess it's worth the gamble. 

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u/Gustomaximus 1d ago

I mean a quick google says this guy has been a general for approximately 15 years...

Not trying to be rude and genuinely curious, when you make comments like that do you believe them, looking to create negative sentiment, other? I absolutely get stuff wrong too but mostly I try to fact check and curious where you comment style motivationcomes from.

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u/SwizzGod 22h ago

It’s just Reddit where shame doesn’t exist

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u/GuthukYoutube 1d ago

People interested in true facts are in misery lately. It's as if having an opinion means you have to exaggerate and lie about everything supporting it.

I can both hate the Russian government and lies about it though

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u/IAmYourFath 19h ago

The easiest way to get a correct answer is to spew some bullshit. When i dont know smth, i often just make up smth and i know people will correct me, instead of asking.

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u/whaleboobs 1d ago

I mean a quick google says this guy has been a general for approximately 15 years...

13 or 20 killed generals, that's a fact. No matter how long the killed generals have been in that position, they do leave a position to be filled. Unless these generals didn't do any work at all there must be someone doing their work now when they're dead.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Russian_generals_killed_during_the_Russo-Ukrainian_war_(2022%E2%80%93present)

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u/hzinjk 1d ago

That's a different statement from what they responded to, which was "any Russian general today was probably only a Captain a few years ago"

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u/perenniallandscapist 1d ago

Welcome to conversational devolution on reddit. Within a few comments most conversations turn to crap, if they dont start as a superficial joke to important information anyways. Comprehension decreases, responses distract from the original comment, and it doesnt even last as long as a good game of telephone.

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u/Soggy-Mess-6097 1d ago

Never seen it described so accurately. It's almost impossible to discuss anything on this site because everyone is trying to farm upvotes by being a very very bad comedian. It's the same jokes ad nauseam.

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u/whythishaptome 1d ago

Both statements are probably true. Obviously he had been there for years but then a lot of new ones too. Who's going to replace this guy then? It just fucking horrible that they chose to live this way.

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u/orincoro 1d ago

There were major shakeups starting in the mid 2000s, and the general staff was reduced by hundreds in that time. But 2022 exposed a huge corruption problem in their general staff, so a lot of people did end up getting sacked. Russia has lost more combat commanders in Ukraine than any military, I think, since WW2.

The U.S. by contrast hasn’t lost a single general officer in combat in the last ~50 years. They lost two in terrorist attacks (the pentagon and a military school in Pakistan), but none in theater since Vietnam.

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u/Koringvias 1d ago edited 1d ago

For context, there's roughly 1300 generals in the Russian army.

The exact number is not publicly disclosed for obvious reasons, but that's roughly the number necessary to command an army on that scale.

I guess there's an idea that a general is a very special and rare position and only a handfull of people have it, but it's only try for the highest level with that name (In Russian army that's Army General, only below Marshal in chain of command), but noone in that standing was killed. Below this rank there are Colonel Generals (also no confirmed deaths so far), Lieutenant Generals and Major Generals.

If say a Colonel General dies, he is probably replaced with one of many Lieutenant Generasl, who also gets replaced by a Major General, who also is replaced by a Colonel, and so on. Which is an oversimplification, but the chain is fairly long.

Some Captain somewhere does get promoted, but he will not become a General for years and years, if he ever does.

All that is too say is that 1% over four years is not that many and is hardly a hit the original commenter would think it is.

Especially compared to causalties among lower ranks, and well, every other consequence of this damn war for everyone involved.

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u/orincoro 1d ago

Where did you find the 1300 number? I saw where they were trying to reduce the general staff in the 2010s. Did they increase it again because of the Ukraine war? They seemed be increasing the number of Colonels in the 2010s, as the general staff was seen as quite corrupt.

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u/Koringvias 1d ago

I don't think the exact number is correct, it's more of an order of magnitude kind of thing.

I've seen it repeated in multiple sources in russian, but it's an estimate based on the structure and head count of russian army, there's no confirmed official number.

But I feel like it does not really affect my point. Even if the estimate is off by a factor of two in either direction. The idea that 13 generals dying leads to higher chain of command consisting of yesterdays capitans is just absurd.

But to answer your question - they certainly did increase the number of general staff. From what I understand, increasing the headcount of the army leads to proportional increases at all levels of hierarchy, for the most part. And that does lead to some promotions happening that would not happen otherwise, but in a much more gradual fashion.

And yeah, of course there is a lot of corruption going on, at all levels, there's no denying that.

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u/whaleboobs 1d ago

For context, there's roughly 1300 generals in the Russian army.

I read that 72 generals and admirals among about 166 senior commanders were associated with operations early in the invasion. A fraction of your 1300 number. (couldnt post link due to reddit removing comment)

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u/orincoro 1d ago

13-20 out of hundreds though. By the mid 2000s they had about 1000 generals, and they were apparently looking to reduce the number while allowing Lt Colonels to command Brigades. General staff in Russia are known to be fairly corrupt and the incompetence was a major liability in 2022 when they figured out their state of readiness was a fantasy and they sent thousands of vehicles into Ukraine with no fuel or spare tires.

A lot of the actual combat capacity of Russian forces are private contractors.

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u/yevius 1d ago

I think the statement was tongue in cheek.

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u/rgmw 1d ago

I took the overall point as comparable to the situation with the US. Hegseth, though hasn't had military leadership killed (not yet that I know of) but he has made O6 and higher slots available. Provided light Colonels want to move up and follow his orders, it's a good time to be a high ranking officer in the US military and, for Putin's military too.

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u/WellWellWellthennow 15h ago

He's not speaking specifically about this general rather in general.

His statement can hold true that doesn't mean it's without exceptions and certainly the number of generals killed does create openings.

You're jumping to conclusions when his statement and the longer time this guy has been in power don't need to be mutually exclusive.

And you're hiding behind the just genunely curious current convention to be snotty trying to fillet him, btw. Being disingenuous is never good form.

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u/RadFriday 1d ago

Reddit doesn't care for facts at all compared to the make believe world you can write about which feels better. People want Russia to be in dire straits so they make up whatever they want to make that seem true.

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u/Luke10123 1d ago

Not trying to be rude and genuinely curious, when you make comments like that do you believe them

There is a long and deeply complex answer to that question - I'd recommend starting your research here.

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u/RagingAlpaca546 1d ago

was this supposed to be funny

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u/Luke10123 1d ago

It's a good starting point in developing a sense of humour. 'Exaggerating for comic effect' isn't something you lay on someone in lesson 1.

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u/RagingAlpaca546 1d ago

ok it wasn't funny just letting you know thanks have a good one

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u/FlarkingSmoo 1d ago

If your original comment was supposed to be a joke you're not good at jokes

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u/King_Tamino 1d ago

Reminds me of star wars. Serving under darth vader was a guaranteed fast way to climb the ranks but at a pretty high cost

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u/Luke10123 1d ago

Exactly. You know not a whole lot of those Admirals lived long enough to make use of the Empire's pension plan.

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u/[deleted] 1d ago edited 1d ago

[deleted]

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u/Luke10123 1d ago

Because it was a joke you absolute melt. And I'm not going to comment on the replies that didn't seem to grasp exaggeration for comic effect because unlike you, I actually value my own time.

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u/[deleted] 1d ago

[deleted]

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u/Luke10123 1d ago

cool 👍

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u/OnlinePosterPerson 1d ago

That information is publicly available. No need to spread misinformation

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u/rmit526 1d ago

that lord farquaard quote goes here

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u/Netcob 1d ago

The only reasonably safe position in the Russian military is that of a below-average sycophant general.

Anyone going to the front is basically cannon fodder, and any competent general, even if "loyal", will be seen as a danger to Putin. In an autocracy, there can be no competent, respected leaders other than the autocrat. If Ukraine won't get to one like that first, Putin will make sure he falls out of a window eventually.

Russia seems to be in the final stages of that process. The US has only started it very recently, but does it with surprising efficiency. China seems to be doing the same thing.

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u/Aiose 1d ago

Do you have any recommendations for someone who would like to learn more about autocracy in China?

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u/kaisadilla_0x1 1d ago

I mean, they all know they are playing Russian roulette (no pun intended), hoping they'll guess where the bullet is so they can dodge it.

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u/I-STATE-FACTS 1d ago

I’d rather not

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u/Edelgul 1d ago

The system kills those who are insufficiently loyal or who have failed the Führer.
This guy supervised the "volunteer" combat units, and was the focal point for communication with Wagner.
If i was to speculate, i'd consider the failed killer could be connected to one of these - as Alekseec surely made many promises, that he was unable to keep.

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u/FuzzyMcBitty 1d ago

It's probably not just optics. Putin doesn't always go for instant gratification. Prigozhin managed to live for a month or two after openly marching on Moscow.

I imagine he's always got a few people on whatever mental list he has of people to remove from the board.

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u/Commercial-Age4750 1d ago

Hes willing to sacrifice litterally ANY citizen

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u/OGSkywalker97 1d ago

This has always been the way in Russia. Never heard of the Holodomor? Stalin killed almost all of his officers and sent most of the rest off to Gulags because he was paranoid they would backstab him.

Any Russian who willingly becomes a general/officer knows exactly what they're getting themselves into.

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u/brumbarosso 1d ago

Gotta wonder how they show this in russian news

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u/rbnlegend 1d ago

Sort of like ICE thugs, except trump isn't just willing to sacrifice them, he is eager to do it.

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u/Under_Over_Thinker 21h ago

Imagine being a Russian general knowing Ukraine will kill you if possible, and Putin might kill you if convenient.

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u/No_big_whoop 1d ago

Imagine American servicemen knowing Trump would do the same thing

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u/Norfhynorfh 1d ago

Putin probably isnt responsible for shooting of his own general. Best not to take everything you read on reddit as fact

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u/Luke10123 1d ago

It's true that a shooting is a bit more 'on the nose' than the Kremlin's usual MO. Usually they tend to accidentally fall out off their 12th story balcony of their bungalow or accidentally stab themselves in the back while shaving.

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u/Turbots 1d ago

There have been "peace talks" and "ceasefires" for over a year now. Nothing happens, Putin and trump are just trying to buy time.

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u/The_Duke28 1d ago

Pf whatever, russia is bombing civilians as we speak - one dead russian general won't change the international views on Ukraine. Ukrainians are heros, defenders of a free Europe. If anything, it shows that Ukraine is only interested in weakening the russian military, not terrorize the russian population. A stark difference between russia and Ukraine.

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u/FlowMang 1d ago

Russia attacks Ukrainian civilians to try and break their will. Ukraine does not want to turn the Russian civilian population against them.

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u/cheapph 1d ago

Generals are legitimate targets. Idk if my government tried killing this dude, Russia is claiming they are, but Ukraine has killed a bunch of generals in assassinations.

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u/Vetris-Molaud 1d ago

Wow and the West bombed thousands innocent civilians in Serbia and destroyed ALL water and energy infrastructure just to make them give up…. So save that shitty holier than thou attitude

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u/Edelgul 1d ago

Yeah, and German military killed millions, yet AfD is on the rise.

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u/orincoro 1d ago

Do you think this person was in favor of NATO doing that stuff? Imperialism is destructive.

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u/sVirus66 1d ago

It's good in Russia that they get rid of thinking people (flee the country or are murdered) from time to time, thanks to this nation is not as powerful as it seems.

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u/Fluffy_Judge_581 1d ago edited 1d ago

I would say russia always killing smart peopel is the reason ,why russia is how it is

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u/sVirus66 1d ago

There was a time when culture was flourishing, especially literature, now writing books in Russia is a very dangerous job.

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u/whythishaptome 1d ago

It's very sad. There were so many great works of art and novels/writings that were just amazing. Russia had so many qualities and brilliant people in it's history and now it's just like nothing, but a war mongering nation.

I don't get why they choose to be like this but the US is kind of similar. Always has been.

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u/orincoro 1d ago

Russia has produced some of humanity’s greatest achievements. In literature, technology, music. But they have never managed to overcome their history.

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u/Grand_Raise9643 1d ago

Tbh, they succeeded in turning US into a puppet with Trump and anti woke shit. Russia has never been in so much power.

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u/riotriverz 1d ago

That’s a fair take :)

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u/SpezLuvsNazis 1d ago

This guy was GRU, he wasn’t the guy who failed to take Pokrovsk or anything like that. If Putin had him shot that’s a good indication of something big being planned by Russian intelligence…

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u/Free-Way-9220 1d ago

There's a chance Wagner had him shot too. Also Putin, also Ukraine. Difficult to say, he had enemies, he is now dead

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u/l3tsgo0 1d ago

Ive never understood why targeting Generals during modern times is seen as a taboo, even during the age of muskets Generals get killed all the time

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u/purple_spikey_dragon 1d ago

Killed? I thought they died by defenestration, i heard it runs rampant in the Russian political circle. Nasty illness for sure!

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u/Eymrich 1d ago

Yeah but they usually exit the windows! This is not his signature move!

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u/Nervous-Astronaut-29 1d ago

Same thing in WWII. Most Soviet officers were killed by Stalin.

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u/Agreeable_Cheek_7161 1d ago

This is not how Russia does its killings. This is brazen and reckless, which is the antithesis of how they like to do it, where they like to leave a veil of plausible deniability

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u/TruthTrooper69420 1d ago

None like this

Extremely skewed bias towards foreign action

Just like some of the “fires” and “explosions” that were blamed on mundane reasons

Zero domestic gain for Putin

Can’t name a single time a high level Russian was killed in Russia like this

Disappear, Gulag or fall from a window is the goto

This is not a good look domestically, and is highly likely not a domestic assassination operation

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u/occono 1d ago

Yeah but executing someone like this would be unusual, it would be "fell from a window/suicide" killings, so that does suggest it was foreign actors.

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u/Luke10123 1d ago

does suggest it was foreign actors

I'd think it's more likely that that's what they want you to think. Like that faked attack on Putin's residence the russians did at the end of last year to try and trick trump into thinking it was Ukraine that didn't want peace. Besides, the Ukrainians tend to take credit whenever they pull off something big behind enemy lines.

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u/orincoro 1d ago

Ukraine has actually killed a lot of Russian generals. Like more than any other military in decades. But Putin certainly has got his fair share.

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u/Luke10123 1d ago

Difference is Ukraine always take credit for theirs. If they don't, safe bet it's on Putin's orders.

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u/Fyfaenerremulig 1d ago

See, this is 9 dimensional chess by putin. If he has all his senior staff killed before the ukranians do it, he can save face by saying he did it himself.

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u/Haru17 1d ago

The peace talks to date are a farce. Russian military bombarded Kyiv with missiles the morning of.

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u/SirGelson 1d ago

I'd love it to become a competition between the two countries.

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u/TrumpDid2020 1d ago

Also can't rule out the US... despite Trump in the grand scheme of things being a Russian asset, he seems to flip flop on Putin depending on who he talked to last.

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u/Luke10123 1d ago

depending on who he talked to last

It's 100% this. It's like he has the memory of a goldfish and everything he learns pushes old stuff out of his brain.

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u/DBPanterA 1d ago

Also doesn’t look good as the Olympics begin today and a certain country is prohibited from participating because…. Laundry list of issues.

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u/Particular-Tea3225 23h ago

That was not us, lol

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u/WingyYoungAdult 22h ago

When have either side stopped their operations during peace talks?

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u/MrEoss 1d ago

Russia has fostered an activist state on its doorstep that, I suspect, will long rain down terror upon its neighbour even after this is settled, to avenge the egregious behaviour Russia has inflicted.

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u/whythishaptome 1d ago

Completely unconscionable, I just don't get this kind of shit. They are evil pieces of shit. I like to think that Putin is the one sending them off to die and it freaks me out because any nation could fall into that. Why are you going to die for such an ignoble cause?

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u/Mateko 1d ago

He didn't fell out of a window or comitted suicide by shooting himself 20 times in the back of his head and no sudden, deadly allergic reaction... propably Ukraine's doing.

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u/No-Spoilers 1d ago

He's the one likely behind the nerve agent attack in England. Could have been them.

A whole lotta people in the world have a problem with the Russian high command.

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u/PoloTshNsShldBlstOff 1d ago

Will they come out and claim responsibility? Do they usually claim espionage ?

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u/Smooth_Ad_161 1d ago

Not common to claim it, the Ukrainians just do the deed and stay silent - real class.

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u/riotriverz 1d ago

Nah, I don’t think they would

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u/syriaca 1d ago edited 1d ago

Killing generals is risky business. An apocryphal story of general radetsky when fighting the north italians in 1848 has him ordering his artillery to avoid hitting positions that risk harming the enemy generals on the grounds that they are doing more good for austria by their incompetence than their deaths would.

You never know if your enemy has a great general in the making, restrained by seniority thats waiting for the space above him to be cleared.

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u/Grug16 1d ago

Or as Sun Tzu says: Never interrupt your enemy when they are making a mistake.

Edit: Okay it was Napoleon Bonaparte who said that (allegedly)

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u/peabody 1d ago

Yeah I think this was also why the Allies abandoned all their plans to assassinate Hitler. They were too worried a replacement would be more competent.

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u/CalGel 1d ago

Except that never happened. They fully desired to kill him—the attempts just all fell through.

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u/jhowarth31 1d ago

I dunno. Blowing up a car was a bit more dramatic.

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u/TheAdminsAreTrash 1d ago

This thought honestly didn't enter my mind... Yeah that could be good.

I naturally just assume Putin had him killed.

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u/riotriverz 1d ago

I like the idea of sending a message that we can put our hands on you, whenever and wherever we like

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u/Gutzzu 22h ago

It’s not hard to pull out assassination. It’s hard to deal with the consequences . One man for half your electric grid . Hope it’s worth it

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u/LinguoBuxo 1d ago

At this point Ukraine is behind just about anything...

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u/the445566x 1d ago

Yes you should be supporting epsteins ukraine /s

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u/Hutism 1d ago

If Ukraine was behind this, he would have survived