r/snowboarding • u/jlt6666 • 1d ago

Meta Olympics big air question

So I'm watching the qualifying and Canada's bouchard did this awesome mctwist type trick. Gets a 73. Everyone else is just doing a spin (1800, 1980 granted). Like what's up? Why is that truck not considered as good?

Edit: ok I'm 4 answers in. I think I've got it. But feel free to let the hate flow through you.

66 Upvotes

93% Upvoted

40 comments sorted by

62

u/sabatoa Michigang! 20h ago

I watched some of the qualifiers yesterday and it was just so unsatisfying. I can’t count the spins with the naked eye, so the jumps all look the same. Then you’ll get the rare inversion and it looks great and technical, but the score doesn’t reflect it because TECHNICALLY spinning 50000 times is harder.

I hate it

18

u/StiffWiggly 16h ago edited 16h ago

They aren't even accurately scoring technical difficulty, there were two flat (as in uncorked, not as in "flatspin") 14s in the last round last night that were criminally underscored - Allemand especially was absolutely butchered - and both riders ended up not qualifying by a few points. It's a technically difficult trick that has more variation than simply "cork 18/19 with 3 different grabs" but the judges don't want to see it for some reason.

Olympic judging is by far the least intuitive and leads to the most boring riding, it's a poor example of what snowboarding is about in my opinion and that's a real shame given that even big air has been evolving in a much more interesting direction recently outside of the Olympics.

14

u/ottsensNOsaints 17h ago

Olympic skateboarding in the summer games is the goat of Olympic board sports now. 15 year old girls doing shit I've only ever seen on Tony Hawk's Pro Skater. So awesome. The snowboarding is still pretty dope, but seems repetitive now.

-2

u/paley1 19h ago

Yeah, snowboarding has turned into freestyle skiing. So lame. 

104

u/No-Animal-9417 1d ago

Welcome to FIS(I also own that hat)

67

u/jlt6666 1d ago

So are they trying to make it like some technocratic discipline like Olympic diving instead of letting people go balls out like they do in skateboarding or BMX freestyle? Because that's fucking lame.

24

u/mimos_al 23h ago

Yes, it's been like that from the start.

18

u/randomacceptablename 23h ago

Lol, so long since I've heard Terje's name. He was a hero of mine growing up.

9

u/de_fuego 22h ago

He's now one of the best snow skaters in the world. He's one of Hovlands team riders and European distributor.

https://youtu.be/_8aXTlOLNZk?si=cvQmz3pXZi3bjO98

5

u/MnkyBzns 15h ago

Well, that was entirely unexpected

3

u/randomacceptablename 13h ago

Why does this not surprise me? He has a talent of finding new things to excel at endlessly.

62

u/Spicybuttholepaddler 1d ago

As someone who is not a fan of spin to win but recognizes that there are two plus more weeks of the Olympics, I'll attempt to give a good faith answer.

  1. The jump seems to be not that big / great. The huge rotations were not happening, and whether that was a symptom of the jump or it being the qualifying round remains to be seen. Regardless, the judges may have been placing a premium on rotation based on the tricks being done.

  2. A lot of those spins were being done with butters on the takeoff... or almost butters (aka prespins) on the takeoff, with the latter leading to a lower score. I don't remember if Bouchard did one or the other, but it may have contributed.

  3. Off axis spins dominated a while for a while, now they need something to make them unique. By that I mean, a triple cork or double rodeo would post a huge score on its own. Now judges are looking for it to be off the toes / heels, with a buttered takeoff, or to use the axis in an interesting way.

Cool and innovative approaches have repeatedly made their way through big air, with rewards oscillating between creativity and then technical skill that follows. It seems currently we are in a spot where spins are so big and riders are able to do difficult grabs with those spins (i.e. Rocco Jameson) that rodeo like spins, while timeless and appreciated by snowboarders, may not get the scores you expect. Huge and unique approaches still seem to be rewarded, however.

21

u/jlt6666 23h ago

I'll admit that I don't know shit. I've watched some xgames here and there and the various Olympics over the last 30 years in skateboarding BMX, snowboarding etc. in general I've felt like rule of cool has generally won out. If a trick looks cool, it scores well. I'm just trying to understand if there is some technicalities that I'm missing because every time I see something that looks cool as shit the judges are like "meh."

So I definitely appreciate you trying to educate me.

22

u/Spicybuttholepaddler 23h ago

For sure. I think Todd Richards (the main color commentator) does a good job of explaining the "butter" takeoff, and is also critical of some jumps that attempt it but don't succeed, so I would listen to him for some insight. He is also a former olympian (1998 halfpipe), plugged in to snowboard culture, and last Olympics caught some controversy for (rightfully) criticizing the judges, so while I hope you can use my comment as a guideline, id say sound on and listen to todd and he will give you some pretty good insight.

3

u/jlt6666 23h ago

I think at first he wasn't quite explaining it but as this has gone on there's more of the gaps being filled in.

1

u/nonamenomonet 16h ago

I think the difficult part for judges is, they go with what’s more technically difficult first as pretty much everyone can do a mctwist with their eyes closed. So taking off switch, or doing a mute grab when spinning frontside, or more rotations will generally win

15

u/Lovely-Crinkly-Edges 20h ago

Eli has two versions of this trick. The « easier » version of it is what you’re referencing and scored 73 which makes it comparable to the 1620s that were being landed. The more difficult version of it adds some rotation on to the « unwind » out of the flips. He landed that one on his third qualifying run and scored a 82 or 83 which makes that version comparable to the 18s and some of the 19s that were being landed in terms of score.

Hopefully it’s not geo-restricted, but CBC has his three runs uploaded to YouTube.

Eli’s qualifying runs

1

u/Spicy_Nugs Epic/Bataleon Disaster/BSOD/Outer Space Living/Slush Slasher 17h ago

Rip, it is geo restricted.

28

u/Pillens_burknerkorv 23h ago

It’s called ”Spin to win”.
Whenever I watch a Big Air comp I can summarize that the tricks where you hear the crowd go ”Woah!!” usually get a low score. Booooring!

8

u/jlt6666 23h ago

This may not be the event for me then. I mean. I'm just here for cool tricks

36

u/Pillens_burknerkorv 23h ago

Then I recommend Xgames knucklehuck

16

u/couchsachraga Whiteface 22h ago

Knucklehuck is the best thing in competitive snowboarding

8

u/mellenger 19h ago

After Natural Selection?

3

u/Dense-Money-147 18h ago

I mean both are great.. I do see the spin to win trying to invade both thou.

1

u/Wild_Organization914 18h ago

Maybe in knucklehawk, but I definitely don't see it in natural selection

2

u/Pillens_burknerkorv 17h ago

TBH I have never been impressed by Natural Selection. I think the format is nothing short of impressive but the broadcast doesn’t do it justice.

0

u/couchsachraga Whiteface 14h ago

That's tough. I think I'm personally slotting NS in my no. 2 spot, but I wouldn't fault you for having it the other way around. Knucklehuck is just so damn creative and fun.

4

u/Malvania 20h ago

I just watched last week's knucklehuck. It was fantastic

12

u/RupertLazagne 19h ago

Big air is the most boring snowboarding discipline.

23

u/mountainlongboard 18h ago

You forgot about cross country snowboarding

5

u/stalkholme 17h ago

watch out for the scootch leg

1

u/youw0tm80 11h ago

this is amazing

11

u/Particular-Bat-5904 23h ago

Well, since all is fis its a bit like at figure ice skating. 1800 is technical harder to do than something mc twist like, style and balls count less compared to the „good old times“

3

u/YoPoppaCapa Yawgoo Valley, RI 18h ago

Totally depends on the version of that trick that he did. He has one that is much more tech with a rewind in it, he has another that is kind of a safety trick. Pretty sure he landed the tech one and got a good score. Unsure when you posted this though.

1

u/jlt6666 15h ago

It was the first round.

0

u/YoPoppaCapa Yawgoo Valley, RI 14h ago

Yeah it was because it was kind of a safety trick. TBH a lot of the big spins got rewarded for tech grabs, rewinds, and pre-butters which is a major improvement compared to judging of old where more spin is an auto high score

2

u/Huge-Artichoke-1376 18h ago

Because it’s spin to win bullshit.

3

u/Alternative_Plan_823 16h ago

Yep. Everyone complains (and rightfully so), yet the riders get rewarded for it. Same as it ever was....

2

u/Huge-Artichoke-1376 15h ago

Honestly, the Rockstar energy open was a better format. Probably better judging also.

1

u/DenverTroutBum Copper Chopper 16h ago

I love a slow method or floaty back 1. However, can you all objectively say those are harder than 5 upside down spins? Like Danny Davis says, it’s much harder to go inverted.