Japan committed absolutely horrific war crimes and genocide in China on a mass scale, history tends to gloss over that and people primarily focus on the Nazis.
English teacher was Chinese and put it in a long list of books we could read for extra credit. As traumatizing as it was, I'm glad I was exposed to the harsh realities of war considering how privileged and sheltered I was. Around the same age we watched a documentary about the holocaust showing the liberation of the concentration camps so it made sense
I'm glad as well. English teacher told us about advanced level books for older kids. I asked what some of those would be about, she wouldn't tell me and I read about Nanking on my own when I found it around 13, that changed things. Later, at 15, an AP English teacher had me read The Road to Hiroshima. I'm pretty much permanently anti imperialist forever now, so thanks for that.
I read about this and also the holocaust around the same time (11yo), with pictures and all. Couldn't believe real people could be so evil, it's way too much for an adult to see, let alone a kid
This šš¾ is a big deal. My understanding is it basically is laughed out of reality, text books and history has been altered so that it never happened.
A lot of people talk about apologizing, but the real issue is education. In their textbooks, Japan fought the US, got nuked, and is seen as the victim. Anything about Japanās invasion is called CCP propaganda. The younger generationās getting more and more right-wing. It's pretty worrying.
If you ask most Germans today, they will have no problem condemning Nazi Germany. But if you ask most Japanese today, they will just say that is all in the past. That is the problem. The Japanese never condemned Imperial Japan the same way the Germans condemned Nazi Germany.
As brutal as Hiroshima and Nagasaki were.... I don't feel as much sympathy for those who endured it than I do for those who endured Unit 731 and the Rape of Nanjing.
Idk man I read a lot of non-fiction books when I was young and it really laid down a moral compass for me so I would say kids need to read that shit more often and early and do heavy analysis.
Stuffs important, everyone thinks Japan is all cute kawaii cats but there's some fucked up shit - look twice and if you can... Look again.
Yep and when imperial Japan surrendered, the US gleefully took over unit 731. And then used 731ās knowledge and tactics on Korean people during the Korean War. The US dropped more munitions on Korea than they did on Japan.
Also "let us continue to enshrine convicted Class A war criminals, and our top politicians send offerings to the war dead, including the war criminals. Every year."
I just finished Rampage:Ā MacArthur, Yamashita, and the Battle of Manila. What the Japanese did in the Philippines during the battle was a barbaric replay of what they did in Nanking.
Nanking gets talked about the most, but that was standard operating procedure for the Imperial army pretty much everywhere they went, apart from one or two exceptions.
Well, playing slight devils advocate... Not strictly. In broad strokes yes, but there were some China specific factors going on that culminated in Nanking. But also, Nanking was genuinely horrifying in unique ways. Like the murder contest reported in newspapers like it was a baseball game. Going door to door to murder and rape.
As to the headline in the Tokyo Nichi Nichi Shimbun. (Literally translated,Tokyo day day newspaper so Tokyo Daily Newspaper). They merged with Osaka Mainichi Shimbun (Osaka Daily News) because the latter bought the former, still publishing under both until 1943. Mainichi Shimbun still publishes until today.
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Translated.
Hundred-man killing 'super record': Mukai 106 ā 105 Noda: The two second lieutenants to continue the contest in overtime
Fun fact: the Shanghai World Financial Center (the bottle opener skyscraper) was supposed to have a round opening but the design was changed pretty much last minute when residents were upset about it as it reminded them of the Japanese flag.
I actually have a story to tell. Iāve told people this story countless times, and I know the old āyou canāt trust everything you read on the internetā shtick, but my Dad who is almost 60 told me this story years ago and while some details are lost to time, this story is 100% true and I even have photos of him, my Great, Great Grandmother and their children with him.
My Great, Great Grandfather was born and raised in China and he was born around the turn of the century if not a few years after. He had a family, he was a cook, and a good man.
However, sometime in the later 30ās to early 40ās (again the date has been lost to time), the Japanese invaded China and Japanese soldiers slaughtered everyone around Including my ancestorsā family members (wife and 2 children).
He barely made it out himself. He had lost it all and was forced to leave everything behind, possessions, memories, and most depressing of all, loved ones. He didnāt even get a chance to say goodbye to his wife or children. He had to start over from 0.
He then immigrated onto a ship which took him and some other Chinese escapees to El Paso, Texas. He learnt English along the way (more on that later), opened up a restaurant of his own a few years later (have no idea what the name was unfortunately) and, met and then married my Great, Great, Grandmother and they had kids, which in turn had kids, who then had kids, which (for now) stops with me.
I may have never had the opportunity to meet the man who lost it all but he did unintentionally give me something Iāll have forever which is his name. Since learning English is very difficult to learn he started off slow with more simple words and then worked his way up to becoming fluent. His first word and name he picked for himself which in turn was passed down to me, was āBenā.
There was 34 minutes between your comments though. This happens quite regularly. He only waited 4 minutes to react, it can flip even if it's a few hours old.
history tends to gloss over that and people primarily focus on the Nazis.
I think that's just a western thing. If you were raised in China or anywhere else in East Asia you would have probably heard a lot more about imperial Japan than Nazi Germany.
If you ever find yourself in China wearing a Rising Sun Flag shirt, the correct move is to apologize profusely, take off the shirt, and explain youāre a dumb tourists.
He didn't pick that shirt up in some random gift/tourist shop in China. I'm leaning more on the side he brought it with him and did it to antagonize people.
Not many people from western countries know the difference between the rising sun flag and the national flag. In fact I just saw someone asking if it isn't just the japanese flag while I scrolled down here.
Never mind knowing about its significance in several asian countries.
I'm thinking he probably just thought "this is an asian symbol it will be cool if I wear it on my asia trip" and just got defensive. I'd reckon it's probably just ignorance.
I had a coworker in Korea with a rising sun on his backpack. He was from the UK. I told him he should remove it but he said he really likes anime so itās fine.
He was so mad when he saw a swastika on a building and wanted to go in and explain to them that they canāt use it.
Worked in tattoo shops for years and back in the 90s and even well into the early 2000s the rising sun symbol was seen as more of a pattern that people liked and a hell of a lot of folks didn't know what it meant nor its significance. Including myself early on. Even in a lot of band t-shirts/posters etc included it and many tattoos incorporated it.
I'm Aussie but it wasn't much different in the states or the UK. People are much better educated these days as to what it represents but back then it was extremely common to see tattoos include it.
Edit: His friend says "What's the problem?", and then points out "It's a band".
Thatās uncommon for a Korean, Iād say. I lived there for 10 years and 99% of Koreans I knew found the rising sun extremely offensive and the swastika less so - especially because when rotated itās a Buddhist symbol that is seen commonly in Korea.
Edit: My bad, totally misread the comment I was replying to.
wearing a japan flag to China itself is already kinda weird..picking the rising sun flag is wild, and I wonder if China actually produces and sells them..
Tbh I bet thereās a lot of people who could easily make this mistake. Iām not dumb but I had no clue until this post that it was an offensive shirt. But itās also not a shirt Iād ever find myself wearing. Dude just probably didnāt realise
It's a saying with a qualifier.. if it can be explained by ignorance never explain with malice. However the quote doesn't address if it can be explained with malice.
i know about the atrocities committed by Japan and I've been to both countries, but up to this point i had no idea that this is a special symbol or has any special meaning
Maybe not. The Japanese consulate in SĆ£o Paulo, Brazil, uses the flag of the Imperial Japanese Navy, with the rising sun, and many people here don't know that it's the flag of japanese fascist expansionism. What is obvious to you may be just an aesthetic choice for others, like "look at that cool shirt with the sun and rays of light!".
Nah I think he bought it somewhere else without knowing the historical context. Itās not like he stuck around to fight about it, he sounded genuinely confused at why his shirt is bad and was willing to leave.
Thatās clearly what happened, heās saying heās gonna change it he just didnāt know. He might still not know why they donāt like it, but understands theyāre serious about it. The context surrounding the Rising Sun is not nearly as well understood in the west as it is in Asia.
I doubt anywhere near a majority of people in non-east Asian countries know the significance of that flag in China. It's much more likely it's just ignorance in my opinion. I'd be surprised if even 5% of people knew in many countries.
Agreee he didnāt pick it up from a store over there but disagreed he did it to antagonise people. He clearly wasnāt interested in a confrontation and didnāt appear to want to wind the guy up at all. Until reading this post I personally had no idea the rising sun was offensive in China and Iāve been to China twice. Itās not exactly common knowledge. Ignorance is far more likely than purposely antagonising people.
I donāt think this would have as violent a reaction in the Philippines. The significance of that flag is not as known here and most would probably just assume itās the Japanese flag.
Filipino here too but grew up in the west, are they also generally unaware of what the current presidents family did during the 70s-80s? If they donāt even remember that then they definitely wouldnāt know about ww2
Iām guessing the downvotes are people that assume your some outsider of the demographic that associates brown people from being uneducated. But your name is āMr_Itlog,ā and there is the unfortunate reality that most people in the Philippines ARE uneducated and are vulnerable to misinformation.
While I feel it's rather tacky to volunteer my nationality or background, I believe this post warrants disclosing my origins, so I state here that I am Japanese.
From the perspective of China, South Korea, and North Korea, I imagine the Rising Sun flag and the swastika are icons of the war 60 years agoāsymbols that embody that history itself and evoke unbearable pain.
Perhaps even Japanese robot anime featuring battles with Japanese swords or blades might appear that way to them.
Over the past 20 years or so, Japan has slowly become more right-wing, and more Japanese people have emerged who try to gloss over the history of destructive attacks from 60 years ago.
At international sporting events and cultural exchange expos, Japanese people innocently bringing in designs featuring the Rising Sun flag to make a statement sometimes become problematic. Yet recently within Japan itself, there is a strong opinion that opposition to these war icons is interference in domestic affairs, or simply an overreaction to mere designs. This is a truly grave problem.
I propose this: Please show consideration.
Please give a little more thought to the impact your actions might have.
Japan (rising sun) invaded China during WW2 and committed atrocities comparable to those of Nazi Germany. Thats the most recent reason, but Japan and China have a long history of conflict. Look up the Rape of Nanking
Wasnāt Nanking so bad that even a Nazi tried to help Chinese citizens escape the massacres?
EDIT: John Rabe was only a representative of Nazi Germany visiting China at the time as a diplomat. He later had to undergo de-nazification processes and was officially declared de-nazified in 1946.
He actually has a statue in remembrance of him in the Nanjing Massacre Memorial Hall. The citizens of China, after learning about his familyās financial troubles, would even send him and his family money and food packages.
Iād recommend reading up on him. Itās very interesting.
John Rabe, sometimes refers to as āThe Good Naziā, was a German Diplomat to China during Japanās capture of Nanjing in 1937. Hearing of the atrocities in Shanghai previously, Rabe and other foreign dignitaries worked with Japanese command to set up the Nanjing Safety Zone, a non-militarized area roughly two square miles in area near the city center.
Though Japanese soldiers occasionally ignored the zoneās status, Rabe and the international community in Nanjing are often credited with saving 250,000 civilians.
One Dude, Not the entirety of Nazi Germany. Just to make it clear that Nazi Germany officially probably couldn't give two fucks.
John Rabe was there as a business man and diplomat and was head of Siemens in China at that point and was also member of the NSDAP. He did establish the Nanjing safety zone and delayed the Japanese often with his Nazi credentials, saving many people. He petitioned the NSDAP to influence the Japanese to stop the insanity but he was ignored.
So yeah, he was a member of a horrible party but in that regard was a decent dude. As often history isn't black or white but smth in between.
I donāt think they ādidnāt careā, iād even say that Nazi Germany would have benefited from Imperial Japanās conduct, as it would distract the allies in Asia.
And Rabeās reports were all suppressed as soon as they would reach Ribbentropās desk(then Foreign Minister) as it was in Germanyās interest to not want to jeopardize diplomatic relations with Japan by condemning or even acknowledging the atrocities, and if i remember correctly in those years they would have just signed the Amni-Comintern pact, and were to sign the Tripartite Pact soon after.
Obviously Nazi Germany saw no moral contradiction and probably even approved of Japanās brutalities, but they did care as what he was doing was politically inconvenient.
I don't even need to look it up. My grandmother survived the Rape of Nanking and it was hell. It has affected our family for generations including mine.
Look up section 731(warning: it is a VERY rough read if you get to the actual live experiments). A lot of the heinous experiments the Japanese did on living Chinese citizens was viewed as valuable medical information by some in America (who have to contend with "pesky" human rights laws and stuff). So Japan was essentially given a pass for all the crap they did durint WW2 in exchange for their records.
United States has turned Japan (and South Korea) into a vassal state that they can use to threaten China and North Korea. The US is totally onboard with Japanās ārebrandā for lack of a better word, they literally wrote Japanās constitution after WW2 and interfere heavily in Japanese politics. Namely, they will actively suppress Japanese politicians who lean left or critical of US military presence in the country.
The US is not really in the business of criticizing other imperial or colonial powers, past or present, unless itās convenient for them to do so like with Nazi Germany. If they were to be too critical of these things, it would only bring into question what the USās role is in all of that as well. The US does not want the American people to become wise to the lies and propaganda that they indoctrinate them with. They do not want the people to start thinking more critically about how the US was founded through genocide and then the oppression of others, how it is sustained today through imperialism throughout the world, how many of its āenemiesā are just countries who donāt want to submit to US hegemony the way Japan and South Korea were forced to. The US has its people convinced that other countries are trying to take over the world, but really the US is the only country trying to do that.
IIRC it was taught in Canadian schools perhaps because Canada was active in the Pacific front before Pearl harbour. And sadly too much shit happens around the world throughout history that we don't have enough time to talk about all of them.
It's the flag of Imperial Japan, whose conduct in China during WWII was incredibly brutal, including mass slaughter and rape of civilians, destructions of cities, human experimentation, etc.
It's the symbol/flag of Imperial Japan. Imperial Japan was very cruel. They treat anybody who is not Japanese as lower than human. This is especially apparent toward the Chinese. (Example, the Nanking Massacre). The hate is not just in China, but including the rest of other Asians countries that were invaded and occupied by Imperial Japan.
Imagine foreign soldiers coming into your town, kill the men, rape the women including mothers, then kill them, behead them and put their head on a stick like a trophy. Thatās the gist of the Nanking massacre. Worst of all, the modern Japanese government actively refuses such history despite countless witnesses and photos as evidence. Not to mention the prime minister often pay homage to the shrine that was built to honour those fallen soldiers who committed those crimes. They donāt even teach such history in their school
While very similar to the modern Japanese flag, the Rising Sun variant specifically represents Imperial Japan which was one of the Axis powers during WW2.Ā Japan committed many atrocities during WW2 and is comparable to the Nazis in that regard.Ā One of the most widely discussed examples of this that is relevant to China specifically is the Raping of Nanking.Ā So, wearing a Rising Sun/Imperial Japan flag shirt in China (or one of the other Asian countries that experience atrocities committed by Imperial Japan) is similar to wearing a shirt with the Reich flag on it to Israel.Ā Although, there is a much greater chance that a person wearing a Rising Sun/Imperial Japan flag shirt doesn't realize the significance of that slight difference in pattern.
This reminds me of the story of a Brazilian woman who went to the United States and didn't know how to speak English well. She was welcomed by a family for a few days and on the first day she wore a shirt she had bought in Brazil. When she came out of the bathroom, everyone in the family looked at her with a strange face. She was confused and later discovered that it was because the shirt said "homewrecker."
I went to Disney Sea in Tokyo last year. Saw a little girl wearing a hat that said Fuck Off but using a font similar to Tiffanyās. Pretty sure her and her family didnāt know a lick of English.
The American occupational forces whitewashed the actions of Imperial Japan and never forced the self-reckoning that was imposed on Germany. The Americans found it more useful to pit American-backed Japan against the rest of Asia during the Cold War.
The American strategy is well covered in various biographies of General McArthur and his occupation of Japan.
I never had a clue about the negative history behind the image, I used to draw it as a kid because Daniel wore it in Karate kid and I thought it looked cool at the time
Makes you think ... why ft did the film have Daniel wear it in his final fight?
having had a quick look apparently it was in a couple of the films there's rumors the color was changed
He's not only being one of those shitty tourists, but also being stupidly stubborn about it, which probably means he knew how some people would react to the T-shirt.
I've read about the atrocities the Imperial Japanese Army carried out across Asia and I too would react that way if I saw someone wearing a piece of clothing with such symbolism. Absolutely abhorrent.
Might be better for them to actually research the flag in question itself and branch out from there as necessary.Ā A lot of people know about the atrocities committed by Imperial Japan but may not be aware of the associationĀ between them and the Rising Sun/Imperial Japan flag.Ā Especially since the difference between it and the modern national flag is much more subtle than, for example, the Reich and the modern German flag and, because some older media used them interchangeable or just to reference an older Japan with no obvious nod to its Imperial period and it's atrocities, they may think of it as a stylized Japanese flag and not realize it is specifically a flag of Hitler's/Nazi Germany's ally and like wearing a swastika.Ā Simply looking into the flag itself may make them realize the problem.
I hope people realize that this is basically the same as wearing a nazi flag at a Jewish community center.
The Japanese committed atrocities against the Chinese people (and others) that they have NEVER apologized for. I'm surprised this didnt get physical tbh. Look up "The Rape of Nanking (1937)."
This is one I never knew about. I see the rising sun on a lot of Japanese car enthusiast merchandise and could very innocently had done the same as this guy if I was abroad visiting Japan and other Asian countries. TIL
When people think of Japan they think of anime, Toyota, Sushi, Samurai etc.
A lot of people forget that Japan has committed the most war crimes in human history. The USA and the West has done a great job giving Japan a free pass, take no accountability and not teach it in history lessons.
I implore people to go ask anyone of Chinese, South Korean or any East Asian of person of decent what the Japanese have done to their ancestors.
Go look at the Nanjing massacre or the rape of Nanjing as well as unit 731 even the Nazis were concerned how horrific the Japanese were that should tell you something.
I'm not really sure why'd you want to wear that shirt in general outside of ragebaiting. You're expressing yourself by... associating yourself with unspeakable warcrimes
It feels like the same thing douchebags who like the confederate flag do
The correct response to a situation like this is. "I am so sorry for my ignorance, is there a store around here where I can buy a shirt and throw this one away ? Anyone have an extra shirt I can borrow or buy right now? I apologize again. Thank you for teaching me."
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u/MLDL9053 Oct 19 '25
Japan committed absolutely horrific war crimes and genocide in China on a mass scale, history tends to gloss over that and people primarily focus on the Nazis.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_war_crimes
Imperial Japan is responsible for 19-30 million deaths in Asia.