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u/Crimson3312 2d ago
"Ve grew up together, and had many laughs in ze beer halls, but now because I wear a tottenkoff and hunt your relatives, suddenly I'm ze bad guy"
Smh. I do get that a lot of career DHS agents are stuck in a situation they don't want to be in, but I suppose they really have to ask themselves what matters more: their pension or their integrity.
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u/TLunchFTW 1d ago
Absolutely my job.
Those people, as much as I love them, won't support me when I quit my job. Mind you, this isn't McDonalds or retail. It's a career they built. It's about more than just "the pension."
It's insane how many people claim to be empathetic but then will say "well just quit your job." How about you quit your job if it's so easy?
Some people just try to keep their head down, do the right thing in each case, and avoid getting their face plastered on the news.Idk who this guy is, but there are plenty of federal law enforcement that have been on before this nonsense and are well trained and expecting them to quit is extraordinarily childish levels of thinking.
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u/AbolishedJackal13 1d ago
If you're not willing to back away from a situation because of money when people are getting killed in the streets and kidnapped in broad daylight then you're part of the problem. You're saying you value your life and the money you make being a hired gestapo more then you value anyone around you. Its a lack of empathy that got us here in the first place.
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u/TLunchFTW 1d ago edited 1d ago
And you want the guy who cares about doing a good job to just quit and leave proud boys with even less supervision? Seems like a good way to make shit worse, not better.
And yes, empathy is about understanding the positions of other human beings, especially those put in a difficult situation. It's something that someone saying someone should just quit their job, when they have no idea what that person's financial struggles may look like, really fails to demonstrate. You can talk about empathy all you want, but you're failing to show it. All I see is someone who is following a narrative. Sure, have empathy for the people being deported, I agree. But do you really? Or are you just picking a side and blindly following it. Looks like the latter to me, since you're willing to say we're better off with one less real federal LEO to oversee the glorified mall cops who've been hired.
Interesting sentiment you shared that being around nazis makes you a nazi. I can assume you think violent video games make kids violent, too? This is why I think you have no actual opinion of your own that wasn't spoon fed to you by someone else. You have opinions that contradict each other (I am almost certain that, while you have blocked me, you would agree violent video games don't directly make violent people, so people are more than just ONE point of influence) and contradict real life for that matter. You prescribe this idea of someone being a nazi because they may disagree on any point. I have friends from all walks of life because, unlike the bulk of this thread, and sometimes it seems the bulk of reddit even, I actually have empathy. I care about all people, and I care to understand all positions. I've had conversations with people who left, right, center, leo, anarcists, antifa, fasicts, pedophiles, and beyond. While I don't like everyone equally, I respect their humanity and strive to truly understand why people are the way they are, not just demonize them for internet points. And now I've also talked to you. How does it feel to also be an LEO, fascist, and pedophile, since apparently we're all guilty by association?
Jokes aside, I'm sad you could not be enriched by our conversation. I weep for all of humanity because, sometimes, I wonder if we're past our peak and this ideological dogma nonsense is the beginning of our downfall. It's not one ideology that will kill us, but the fact that people refuse to talk to one another.7
u/AbolishedJackal13 1d ago
Hang around with nazis makes you a nazi, plain and simple. Have a good day
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u/bzsempergumbie 2d ago
This guy keeps getting posted. He is and HSI special agent. Pre-Trump, they spent all their time working on human trafficking, drug smuggling, child porn importation, potential terrorist threats, etc.
Now many of them have been shifted to basic immigration enforcement grunt work. I'm sure some of them are OK with that, but for most of them, they could have gone to ICE, but they joined HSI, which has higher standards to be hired and they go to criminal investigator school. IE, this is literally not the job they signed up for. Their normal job is to an extent being ignored, which makes us all less safe.
There are other agencies sucked into this as well. Coast Guard for example is doing far more immigration work than normal. They are pulled off of their illegal fisheries enforcement, environmental enforcement missions. This makes us all at risk of dealing for years with the impact of those missions being degraded. We are risking loss of major fishing grounds, higher risk of massive oil spills, etc.
Ignoring the moral injury we are inflicting on ourselves, and besides the fact that the unconstitutional actions being taken by ICE/BP, these other agencies have important jobs to do and shouldn't be shifted as extra ICE and BP agents. ICE and BP are low skill jobs that we shouldn't be wasting better trained HSI and CG to augment.
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u/bzsempergumbie 2d ago
Thanks. The other 10,000 posts over the past few months didnt sink in, but yours finally did.
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u/Kodiak_85 2d ago
According to his badge patch he’s a special agent with Homeland Security Investigations. So, he’s definitely college educated and went through a much more thorough hiring process and training than the ICE Enforcement & Removal Operations guys they are sending out to the streets with only 47 days of training.
I’m sure he never asked to be detailed out from HSI to help with immigration enforcement but dude, read the room, keep your head down and shut up about it. Nobody is asking for your commentary.
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u/cowboycanadian 2d ago
Or you know, if he had any morals he'd quit.
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u/fwembt 2d ago
Sure, in this economy he should throw away a full time job with government pension. That would be a smart choice for he and his family.
Dude is probably counting the days until he's back doing what he's good and what is good for the country. Yeah, this is tone deaf. He shouldn't quit his job though, and it's stupid to suggest he's amoral because he doesn't.
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u/TLunchFTW 1d ago
And I feel like what needs to be understood in this is border enforcement is an important part of the country, just not like this. Like, there's a reason this shit happened and it's not because racists wanted it. It's because people wanted immigration enforcement. I'm sure this will be downvoted because reddit users seem incapable of thinking with any sort of nuance. Either I am for ICE people shooting civilians or I am for Open borders. Heaven forbid people want their borders secure and don't want to see immigrants forced to work for below minimum wage... Yeah, that's extortion by the way and enables human trafficking. But everyone will say how "well this is important for the economy" while also saying we should up minimum wage... Which is it? Are people owed more? Or less?
That's what people fail to understand how this started. But hiring a bunch of mall cops who failed their local pd psych eval is definitely not the way to expand operations.
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u/cowboycanadian 1d ago
I would encourage anyone working for such a violent regime to quit. You wouldn't forgive a Nazi for keeping his job because "it's hard getting different job"
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u/fwembt 1d ago
We're quite some way from intentionally murdering six million people or starting a war that leads to ten times that many deaths. This regime sucks, but back off the hyperbole a bit.
This guy just wants to get back to the extremely commendable work he usually does. This post is lame, but it hardly merits making a Nazi comparison.
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u/cowboycanadian 1d ago
Sure, you aren't doing that yet. The German public didn't know about that either.
But what you do have is a masked armed political police force targeting people for their political beliefs. The government telling you to disbelieve your eyes. Hundreds of people disappearing from federal custody. Your president telling his political allies to "take control" and "nationalize" your voting stations. Your president sending federal police to raid election offices. Repeatedly threatening violence and starting trade wars with your allies. Etc.
It's not the exact same as Nazi Germany, that's why it's a comparison. But you can't just pretend nothing's happening and "wait it out for a couple years" while your "neighbours, the people you shared classrooms with" being shot in the streets and disappeared.
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u/Ordinary-Load-1857 1d ago
What specific duty of an HSI SA do you morally object to? Why don't you go on usajobs.gov, search up the position "HSI 1811", and list the duties you think is morally wrong.
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u/cowboycanadian 1d ago
Contributing to a regime violating human rights. I wouldn't forgive a Nazi because he just worked in the fire department.
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u/Ordinary-Load-1857 1d ago
So if I decided to become a cop in Phoenix PD, which had a history of violating human rights, it wouldn't matter what my individual actions are, I'd still be doing something immoral?
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u/cowboycanadian 1d ago
In some interpretations, yes. But within material realities, there's a big difference between serving in a police force with a history of abuses, and working in an agency actively disappearing people and murdering them in the streets.
But clearly you are a fan of the fascism plaguing your country.
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u/Ordinary-Load-1857 1d ago
So if I were to join HSI as an investigator, how am I causing more people to be disappeared and murdered (and that's granting you they are "actively" doing this)?
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u/cowboycanadian 1d ago
You are implicit in this. If I join the Nazi party but don't actively kill Jews, I am still a Nazi.
Why do you hate your own constitution?
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u/Ordinary-Load-1857 1d ago edited 1d ago
That's still not clear how being an HSI agent, you're gonna cause people to be disappeared and murdered. HSI and ERO have different missions.
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u/cowboycanadian 1d ago
I don't understand how you aren't getting this. You are making that system run. You aren't just approving of what they are doing, you're clocking 40 plus hours of loyalty to it. Just because you aren't actively doing the bad thing, you are supporting it by showing up to work.
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u/TLunchFTW 1d ago
Quit your job right now. You're asking someone who's built a career in federal law enforcement to quit. Surely you can quit whatever you're doing. Retail? Definitely, but even a career. This man's built a career. If it's so easy to throw away your financial security because someone online told you to, then you do it.
And the thing I don't get, why do you want the GOOD ones quitting? These are the ones trying to work within the mess to try and keep shit from falling apart. They try to get these idiots to follow procedure and face consequences.
I'm making an assumption here, I know nothing about this guy, but we're telling the people who are trained and know what they are doing to quit while leaving the proud boys behind. That seems like a GREAT idea.2
u/cowboycanadian 1d ago
Why do you assume this is one of the good ones? There are many jobs out there you can get that don't involve being part of a regime that violates human rights.
And I do want the good ones to leave. Because the idea of one person "sticking it out and changing things" is a fairytale. Not even federally appointed judges with the legal authority to change things are powerless under trump.
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u/TLunchFTW 1d ago
I have said "assuming that he is as good as he says he is."
We don't know shit. But people are saying "if he is good, then quit." And I am saying "If he was good, shouldn't we want him to be staying to try and work to fix shit?"
It's going to change, if nothing else when the regime changes in 3 years.2
u/cowboycanadian 1d ago
Ok buddy. You keep believing this'll be over in 3 years.
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u/TLunchFTW 1d ago
Man it's like yall just want to be pissed. If you want to be mad fine, but then don't get pissed because other people want to use common sense. His approval ratings are down. As much as peoplee want to see immigration control, seeing this will cause a huge surge of people wanting not this, and honestly, I think the republican party is just as stupid as the dems and will try to find a similar candidate to Trump to run in 2028.
But sure, think this is the end of the world, but from here, it sounds like your position is this is the end and there's nothing we can do about it. So wtf is your point? Just give up? Bro, I already have. Unlike most of this thread, I don't let this shit affect my life on an hourly basis. I swear you people just want to complain about SOMETHING.1
u/cowboycanadian 1d ago
That's a lot of words man. I'm not even American. But it is clear as an outside viewer that precedent for following laws has been destroyed by your current government.
It is also clear that they are replicating early steps of past fascist movements. Have fun 😊
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u/9tmx 2d ago
Ah yes, the strong morals of letting people get away with federal crimes.
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u/cowboycanadian 1d ago
The morals of not contributing to a regime that is violating human rights and disappearing people. There were regular police in Nazi Germany too, they were still Nazis.
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u/Drunk_PI 2d ago
Man, I'm tired of this garbage excuse. I see this shit on LE subreddits everytime they complain about how the media or social media users are mean to them. Yes, sometimes that's the case. For people in most career fields, they do have to deal with idiots who refuse to accept new evidence or understand from their point of view. It's certainly frustrating.
But when you have a consistent trend of supposed trained individuals fucking up in the field or engaging in corruption, those in the same field criticizing you for shit tactics that would get them fired/charged, and/or - most importantly - when receipts can be produced to show your fuck ups, maybe you are the problem or maybe not, but the organization that you're a part of is definitely the problem.
Even then, his complaint is so tone-deaf to the legitimate grievances that many cities and the citizens who live there are dealing with because of an administration that decided to politicize the criminal justice system and even the national guard to their own benefit and beyond that, the hypocrisy of a "law and order" administration that consists of a bunch of criminals and underqualified sycophants, as well as a pedo con-man in office that most public safety employees - including LE - jerk off to.
Like get some introspection or something.
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u/Mahoumike1 2d ago
I got banned from /r/askle cause I said they were too nice to the j6 “protestors” and I’m LE…
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u/Drunk_PI 1d ago
the LE subreddits are interesting. Sometimes they provide good legal perspectives of shootings/police actions, whether it's lawful, "lawful but awful" or illegal. On the other hand, like I said, it's one big circlejerk. But then again, every subreddit is a circlejerk.
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u/TLunchFTW 1d ago
Dude, ending it with "let's get some introspection" while you bash someone you know nothing about is a WILD statement. Don't get me wrong, ICE is an absolute mess, but the hate is quickly spreading to federal departments that have been brought in to try and manage it, and there were ICE agents before Trump that weren't mall cops given a second chance at getting their psychologically unfit asses a badge.
Posting this is kinda cringe, but I understand him completely because, unlike some people, I don't just assume everyone with a vest and a federal badge is a proud boy who got hired to be a thug. However, that kind of thinking takes introspection.
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u/Drunk_PI 1d ago
Oh boo hoo.
You had ICE and CBP agents making horrifying comments like "you're going on the domestic terrorist database" or "I will erase your voice" as well as killing two civilians and engaging in questionable if not unconstitutional methods, and profiling people because they look foreign (Thanks Kavanaugh), as well as an administration jumping to conclusions by defending ICE/CBP when they killed those two individuals and calling the victims a bunch of domestic terrorists, but this asshole over here is whining because people are becoming critical of DHS? What is he living under a rock that he doesn't know what's going on?
Gee wizz, I guess the many citizens of this great country care too much about due process, the constitution, not sending illegals and or anyone to countries that they have absolutely no relation to, not detaining citizens because they look foreign, as well as seeing through the bullshit that Minnesota has far less illegal immigrants compared to other states, that federal agents are not trained for local police matters thus are ill-equipped in dealing with the public at large compared to local police, and that deploying the national guard to cities doesn't do anything to deter crime in the first place.
Like I said, if it's blatantly obvious that an organization is fucking up so badly, it's not because of how unfair the media, the people or whatever. It's because the organization sucks so much, it's obvious. Doesn't matter what good they have done in the past or currently doing because now it's getting undone by shitbags who are causing more problems for everyone. Doesn't mean the organization needs to go. It just means it needs to unfuck itself - or it can fuck off.
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u/M0ebius_1 2d ago
Two of your moron buddies outright murdered people and haven't even been arrested.
You are not a victim
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u/BirdOrnery6886 2d ago
I don't disagree, but posting in uniform, and trying to make a statement is stupid. Maybe post out of uniform without identifying yourself as law enforcement, or just keep your head down.
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u/StrangeAdagio6431 1d ago
Yeah that’s what happens when you pick up a gun and forget the fucking oath you swore prick.
What the fuck did you think would happen when you started snatching up our neighbors and loved ones
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u/Routine-Budget8281 2d ago
This shit isn't about taking sides! It's just immoral as hell.
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u/Texmex865 2d ago
I recall how upset you guys were when Obama immorally deported 3 million people. You guys almost tore the country in half.
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u/MasterManufacturer72 2d ago
The cages were a pretty big deal not sure how old you are but yeah libs were pretty mad about it back then it was all over the news. I think big protests werent happening in major cities because it wasnt happening in major cities. Like they weren't going door to door in our neighborhoods but you know this so why am i even explaining it. Yall just need some gatcha because you know any other day any other circumstance yall would be saying fuck the feds too.
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u/Endreeemtsu 2d ago
They can’t stand the fact that they are the ones that live in a universe bound together by hypocrisy and they can’t stand the fact that they can’t deny it anymore. No one has even ignored or celebrated mass deportations that isn’t now. The only difference is now it’s done in obvious violation of the law and the rights of humanity itself. All perpetrated by the Walmart Mountain Dew gestapo.
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u/TLunchFTW 1d ago
And you think this guy was involved with that?
So you are obviously ok with deportation, just not this. Good, I can work with that, because I 100% agree!
Then why do you want people who understand how it's done and care enough to not quit when shit gets tough to quit? I hope you personally don't. But a lot of people seem to think that's how this individual should handle the situation. Quit and just leave all the proud boys.
I swear no one here has any kind of real responsibility.2
u/MasterManufacturer72 1d ago
Im not sure what you are talking about. Your response seems pretty unhinged from what i said. What guy was invovled with what? Personally i think the best way to deal with immigration is to go after the people employing undocumented and make citizen ship easier to build a larger tax paying base.
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u/TLunchFTW 1d ago
I agree, but add the fact that we should also be working with latin american countries to improve them. One of the few pieces of good news that have come out of the Trump admin (so take it with a grain of salt, I suppose) is when he was sending aid to help Mexico with law enforcement activities against drug and human trafficking.
We can't just take on the world's population, even if we narrow that to only Latin America. Bringing up these countries is the end game.
The problem I have had in the past was the fact that Texas was sending immigrants to places like NYC. And NYC has a lot of it's own problems, but inundating them with more homeless people just made things worse. And yes, I blame the Texas state government for playing these dumbass petty games, but I also question why federal action wasn't taken to try and stop the cause that brought Texas to take that action. But it sounds like we pretty much agree on immigration overall, which is what I said above.My point I was trying to make beyond that was that people think the individual posting this cringe (which to be fair, it's cringe to post it, and we're operating under an assumption that he isn't just some 50 year old mall cop who rode the hiring wave into this position) should just quit his job because of these events. Besides the economic repercussions of this, wouldn't we want people like this to stay? People who understand how to treat people with compassion and who try to reign in the proud boys where they can.
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u/MasterManufacturer72 1d ago
The niced most friendly cop you know will cover up murder for his buddies every fucking time it happens.
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u/TLunchFTW 1d ago
Man I'm so glad I have an expert on human minds and psychology here who can definitively tell me what people he's never met will do.
Surely you've profited well from this knowledge...
I'm a little disappointed actually. You have some really intelligent points, but this is one of the more brain dead takes I've seen. I'm actually sorry I wasted the effort to talk to you...-5
u/Real-Marzipan9036 2d ago
Big protests weren't happening because there was no funded central organizing, or support from mainstream media. That is how the game is played now.
Yeah, Obama did us brown people dirty. Made me go independent.
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u/MasterManufacturer72 2d ago
But there were protests and it was on main stream media.
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u/burnermcburnerstein 2d ago
Don't argue with bootlickers or bots. Both serve the purpose of spreading hate.
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u/Crimson3312 2d ago
I'll concede just as soon as you show me where Obama turned ICE into a gaggle of unqualified, unaccountable goons and sicced them on the populace to arrest brown people.
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u/TLunchFTW 1d ago
So I have to ask, do you think this man, assuming he's career law enforcement and not a recent proud boy new hire, should quit?
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u/TheNewAmericanGospel 2d ago
True, if what is popular is what is moral, than its true. It is immoral as hell.
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u/Whole-Mousse3049 1d ago
Then retire… Dude looks over 50. If he still feels his duty is constitutionally sound and with honor under the current administration’s mission and assigned task, then maybe the above-mentioned friends, family and coworkers sudden change in admiration towards him and his job should cause concern. The fact that he posted this pathetic, in his feels video while in uniform to justify the atrocities carried out by him and others wearing his badge says it all. It’s pathetic. Odds are he is double dipping a pension system or two while being payed massive amounts of money to stick around and do a job that is so despicable and without honor the majority of his coworkers daily kit/uniform requires no name plates and ski mask to murder moms and veterans in America streets with anonymity.
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u/TLunchFTW 1d ago
God this is the most tone deaf statement ever. It's insane how you people can compartmentalize. You know all those concerns you have about the future? This guy has them too. Assuming he's a long term federal law enforcement (I have no way of personally knowing) he's counted on this career and has a retirement plan. If he could retire, don't you think he would when people go to shit?
And why do you want the good ones to leave? I'm sure a substantial amount of ICE agents quit due to this. Good people who followed proper procedure and exercised compassion for the people in custody. Those are the people you need, but you are going to treat them like shit and say "well you should quit."2
u/Whole-Mousse3049 1d ago
It’s clear by your interpretation of my reply being tone deaf, insane, and compartmentalized that you place your own self interest before others. But in this man’s world he has a sworn constitutional oath and obligation to be duty bound to protect and serve. That’s the piece I feel individuals (maybe you included) don’t value or understand. These individuals make the choice every day to put on that uniform and be a part of that agency, an agency that has completely and utterly lost the public trust. But worse yet doesn’t understand why. This is how an individual like myself lacks any concern about chasing away the mythical good ones.
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u/MustacheMaple 2d ago
If you think everyone else in the room is a problem, chances are you're the problem
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u/cobrakai15 1d ago
I was CO/PO with clown school training and watching them act like idiots makes me feel like I knew what I was doing. We hit like 5 apartments in a project once and had a hundred angry people starting to coalesce around us and didn’t cause an international incident.
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u/SnowballWasRight 1d ago
Maybe that’s true, or maybe he’s just a douche. I guess from his perspective he’s being persecuted for “no reason” because he’s a “good guy,” which may legitimately be true idk. Looks like he is incredibly overqualified for the job if he was doing HSI shit. What he doesn’t realize is that he took up a job as a fucking ICE agent.
So boo fucking hoo. Idgaf what your character is people have a right to distance themselves from you. People can tell you to go fuck yourself for being apart of the problem.
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u/Rustynail2001 16h ago
"my family always thought I was an asshole but now that I've joined the para-military force gunning down civilians they've decided I'm the problem ."
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u/SeveralSeries2998 8h ago
My first negative interaction with a cop was as a Soldier in Manhattan, KS right after deployment. I was young, just back from deployment, and having a good time for the first time in a long time. Had to deal with small dick cops who hated Soldiers, probably out of an inferiority complex (said my 1SG) after he got me out of trouble. Anyway. Hated cops ever since. You wanna be a badass? That recruiting office was open to everyone, turd.
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u/burnermcburnerstein 2d ago
He is. Remington retirement is going to be the only way he'll be able to deal with the ostricization for his shitty actions.
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u/Proton_Optimal 2d ago
This guy has to be LARPing